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    Interesting discussion on CWD...

    Learn something!

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    "Oh fuck"

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    I'll be watching it today!

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    How long will it take a CWD spinoff to start into turning humans into zombies! Doesnt seem like too much of a stretch when they talk about sheep rubbing their skin off due to some similar prion disease....

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    Last edited by Lycanthrope; 08-09-2018 at 11:09 AM.

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    ,Humans have their own version of CWD, creutzfeldt jakob disease, so a zoonotic change in CWD seems unlikely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DirtyMike View Post
    ,Humans have their own version of CWD, creutzfeldt jakob disease, so a zoonotic change in CWD seems unlikely.
    So your saying its possible....

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    I must admit, I listened to the whole thing. Very interesting discussion that I learned a lot from. Especially in the science part of related diseases, incubation time, transmissibility and other species ability to carry it, etc; as well as how it has already spread to other countries (Norway, South Korea). CWD is a really bad deal. Kinda makes me wonder if stuff like this isn't how extinctions happen.

    After last year's drought where ND shipped in hay from all over the Great Plains, that discussion of it being carried in by hay bales was particularly eye opening.

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    "Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself." Mark Twain, speaking on Congress.

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    I will finish the video layer, but suffice it to say this is much more serious than some want to admit. The big question is why after many years it has begin to spread.

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    is it spreading more? or are we just looking harder/better?

    have to imagine these have been around forever

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    Quote Originally Posted by guywhofishes View Post
    is it spreading more? or are we just looking harder/better?

    have to imagine these have been around forever
    That's a good question and I have not watched the entire video so maybe they talk about it. I don't know. I suspect it's spreading for two reasons. First we know it spreads within small geographic areas. Second we have been monitoring deer farms for years. They are clean and hundreds of miles from known sources, then bam infected. Is it in food, the environment, or the purchase of an infected animal? I don't know. Perhaps there are other possibilities.

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    Quote Originally Posted by guywhofishes View Post
    is it spreading more? or are we just looking harder/better?

    have to imagine these have been around forever

    While it's a long video, the question of it spreading is answered by the prevalence in the population numbers. The Norway infection of a reindeer herd was a really interesting topic.

    There is no question it is spreading. Overall, a very fascinating discussion of CWD if you haven't already watched/listened. I was pretty surprised after having initially seeing how long it was that I lasted until the end. I don't usually have that much of an attention span.

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    "Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself." Mark Twain, speaking on Congress.

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    http://www.startribune.com/louisiana...ase/490173741/

    I hope to listen to the podcast today. I am surprised more states haven't looked at deer urine as a possible source of spreading CWD

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    Last edited by Reprobait; 08-11-2018 at 06:40 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Allen View Post
    While it's a long video, the question of it spreading is answered by the prevalence in the population numbers. The Norway infection of a reindeer herd was a really interesting topic.

    There is no question it is spreading. Overall, a very fascinating discussion of CWD if you haven't already watched/listened. I was pretty surprised after having initially seeing how long it was that I lasted until the end. I don't usually have that much of an attention span.
    I still don’t understand how we’re confident that it’s not just always been around and the “spread” is just an artifact of us looking for it now

    scrapies is ancient - can’t CWD be as well and we’re just increasing monitoring/awareness?

    - - - Updated - - -

    i.e. we never found it in places earlier because we weren’t looking

    - - - Updated - - -

    https://undark.org/article/chronic-wasting-disease-cwd/

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    Last edited by guywhofishes; 08-11-2018 at 08:07 AM.
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    Scrapie is ancient but like the guy said, there are now over 30 different subtypes so even though they are dead proteins, they change and are constantly mutating.
    excellent discussion by an obviously very knowlegable fellow! Lots of references and examples of recent findings. Yes, the hay bales are interesting.
    even more interesting will be the reindeer kill off and what will happen over the years once reindeer are reintroduced! What I want to follow though I’d the hundreds of hunters and their families who MUDT HAVE dated bad prion infected meat from healthy looking reindeer. I’ll breathe a lot easier for my fellow hunters if they can show that none of 5hem get any variant of Spongiform Encephalopathy in the next 30 -40 years.
    Like the fellow said, we all have billions of,our own prions circulating through our bodies in very cell (we’d die if we didn’t) but if some are induced to form badly, then we’d be in trouble.
    Yes, there might be a bit more disease around partly because we are looking for it. Lots of cancerous and infectious diseases are like this, but that doesn’t make them less important or potentially lethel.....the more we study something, the more we know,about it! Denial ain’t just de river in Egypt!

    - - - Updated - - -

    You are right Allen. You can’t kill prions because they are already dead! Just chains of dead amino acids, resistant to heat (1000 degrees) and pressure, lye, and all the other things that have been tried, such as down in Colorado. Can’t look at it like bacteria and viruses! Old Louis Pasteur must be rolling in his,grave!
    Thanks for,the link Lucan! Best discussion I’ve seen yet.

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    I’m asking how the scientists looking into this account for the fact it’s just been monitored for a relatively short period of time. How can you know it’s “spreading” if you hadn’t been looking decades earlier.

    It’s fine if nobody knows the answer, but that’s no reason to label it as “denial”.

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    Like HIV and many other “new” or at least newly discovered other diseases, the origins and spread are worked out pretty well by the epididimology people. I’m sure they could be wrong on some of the zigs and zags of its transmission.
    Like in ND. As little or nothing was known of CWD 20-30-50 years ago no one was concerned about it. Now with their surveillance monitoring they are finding a bit of it. Was it always here you are asking, Guy? I dunno and am not sure anyone knows, positive or negative. But I’m sure there is a lot of truth in by looking more for it we’ll find more. But that’s all to the good, the more that is known the better intelligent rational decisions can be made to contain it, treat it or eradicate it. That’s how disease Science works I guess.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I’m not going to hang up my guns or bows because of concern about CWD in healthy appearing animals. However, i admit that I’m always a bit relieved when I read that my harvested deer from a surveilled zone was tested negative. Many of my hunting buddies agree.
    I’d like to suggest a totally voluntary program where a hunter outside a surveilled zone could have his deer jaw lymph nodes tested for a cost, 5 or 10 bucks, (I have no idea the real cost, just a made up number) and the G&F OR a private company could work with a private lab , test your deer, then let the hunter know. Would it be worth it when you know that maybe 99% of deer will be neg? I dunno. Strictly voluntary and the hunter would pay the cost for the assurance his/her deer is fine. Might be a part time business for some entrepreneur. A money maker in the future. I’m too old to start something like this but it could be a very viable business. Farm the samples out to private labs to begin with, then if it took off, build your own lab and WOW! Figure the millions of deer harvested countrywide and people wanting reassurance......
    Also, data from this could help researchers and G&F.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobkat View Post

    I’m not going to hang up my guns or bows because of concern about CWD in healthy appearing animals. However, i admit that I’m always a bit relieved when I read that my harvested deer from a surveilled zone was tested negative. Many of my hunting buddies agree.
    I’d like to suggest a totally voluntary program where a hunter outside a surveilled zone could have his deer jaw lymph nodes tested for a cost, 5 or 10 bucks, (I have no idea the real cost, just a made up number) and the G&F OR a private company could work with a private lab , test your deer, then let the hunter know. Would it be worth it when you know that maybe 99% of deer will be neg? I dunno. Strictly voluntary and the hunter would pay the cost for the assurance his/her deer is fine. Might be a part time business for some entrepreneur. A money maker in the future. I’m too old to start something like this but it could be a very viable business. Farm the samples out to private labs to begin with, then if it took off, build your own lab and WOW! Figure the millions of deer harvested countrywide and people wanting reassurance......
    Also, data from this could help researchers and G&F.
    Bobkat, sportsmen can purchase a test kit from SAWCORP for $14.95. The lab work is an additional $50 to get the results. I believe the lab work is to be done at a genomes lab in Fargo. If something suspect is found they will forward to Aimes Iowa.

    https://sawcorp.com/press-release-sa...lood-test-cwd/

    Many claims are made that New Zealand Cervid meat imports to the USA are CWD free because New Zealand is CWD free. How can they claim that when they refuse to test for it?

    Montana wasn't really looking for it until last year when an Oregon sportsmen harvested an elk in Montana and then crossed back into Oregon at a game check station. Oregon officials found Montana's first case. Wow. Montana got on the ball and promptly found 4 more from 4 different areas. How many decades its been around could be any ones guess?

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    Ii had the experience of taking a animal out of the ND herd a few years ago that had CWD. It was tested by ND G&F and came back positive. I believe at that time it was the 9th discovered positive in ND in their testing, there were 2 positives that year. Hadn't used the meat yet at that time. I asked the biologists at the G&F that I gave as much info as I could about where shot and such, if they would eat the meat from their research and experience and they stated at that time they wouldn't, but they believed a few critters out of ND that were never tested have been consumed in ND and those people had never reported problems but as stated you cannot destroy by heat from cooking and such. I choose not to consume that deer knowing it was positive for CWD. I also will not stop hunting and have killed and consumed many ND deer and who knows if any had CWD and were not tested but consumed. I haven't watched the video yet but will at sometime but I try to keep myself as informed as possible about this but cant let it stop the activities I enjoy. dukgnfsn

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    Thanks for the info ducknfishin. I don’t think I’d eat the meat from a known positive tested animal either, though I’ve eaten s Lot of wold meat here and there over the years, who knows. And even having eaten positive animals, that doesn’t necessarily mean you WILL ultimately develop CzJ disease and no one can even tell you the odds. It may even be zero but who'd knowingly take the chance. Most wouldn't!

    Id almost think the G@F would give you a replacement license to anyone with a positive carcass though we never hear about the results till way after the season end. Still, at least a free rain check for next year might help soften the news of a positive test. Wouldn’t be many extra tags, a handful a year.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Fritz the Cat View Post
    Bobkat, sportsmen can purchase a test kit from SAWCORP for $14.95. The lab work is an additional $50 to get the results. I believe the lab work is to be done at a genomes lab in Fargo. If something suspect is found they will forward to Aimes Iowa.

    https://sawcorp.com/press-release-sa...lood-test-cwd/

    Many claims are made that New Zealand Cervid meat imports to the USA are CWD free because New Zealand is CWD free. How can they claim that when they refuse to test for it?

    Montana wasn't really looking for it until last year when an Oregon sportsmen harvested an elk in Montana and then crossed back into Oregon at a game check station. Oregon officials found Montana's first case. Wow. Montana got on the ball and promptly found 4 more from 4 different areas. How many decades its been around could be any ones guess?
    Yep, who knows how long or how it got there, or did it just form itself there?. Lots of questions.
    the lab testing! Dang, someone beat me to it! My money making schemes are always too late! LOL. Wonder what it costs the G&F per test?

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    It takes the NDG&F awhile to collect samples. They are then sent to the University of Michigan. If a suspect is found they forward to Aimes Iowa who then notify NDG&F who in turn inform the sportsmen he has a positive in his/her freezer. This process can take 3 months. Much of a deer can be consumed by then. Some hunters elect to throw the remainder out while some choose to eat it.

    However, if said hunter takes his/her positive deer to a processor to have sausage made, that positive may be co-mingled or go through the same grinder with many other deer during a days work/shift. There is no way of going back 3 months to see who's deer were co-mingled with what on any givin' day.

    Bobkat, investors with waaaaay more money than you and I made the decision to fund research into finding a live animal test and/or a cure. The profit potential would be HUGE. So far the answer eludes. Government research facilities are also competing furiously for funding. It's a race.

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