Protecting Schools

[Chas'n Tail]

First, I'm not looking to turn this into a gun control pissing match. I am just curious as to what people outside of the "CNN" types think about what to do to protect schools. I am somewhat formulating an opinion, but working in a school myself, I am also very curious as to what other people think is a good idea. Hire security? Constant lockdown? Metal detectors? Arm staff? Get rid of guns all together? Point blank, I guess I feel this isn't even a gun control issue any more than a guy who gets in a vehicle intoxicated and kills a family on the road is a vehicle issue. Its all about who is running the gun. So instead of trying to focus on guns, I'd like to see a discussion at the national level talking about something that can directly impact these school shootings. Defend the schools! Anyway, what are your thoughts?

 

[JayKay]

You hit the nail on the head. The gun isn't shooting people. People are shooting people. But you already know that.

I read today in the paper that they're talking about having an office at each school, so that troopers who routinely do a lot of paperwork in their car, could do it in a school. I would think that having a highway patrol car parked by the front door, might not be a bad idea. And having a trooper in the school couldn't hurt.

Not a bad idea. I don't see real down-sides to it..

Thoughts?

 

[628977]

Update the schools to function more like prisons. You dont hear of many guys trying to break into prisons and succeeding.

 

[PrairieGhost]

I took an eight hour training symposium on the subject of church and school security just two weeks ago. Timely I guess. They estimate that half the cost of building a school is to meet fire code even though no child has died in a school fire for 50 years. Your right this is not a gun problem it is a behavior problem. These mass killers are desensitized to death and creatures of opportunity. This demands a two pronged solution. First and immediately eliminate our schools as soft targets. Laminated glass in doors, metal detectors, and trained armed people inside the school.

Today when we talk about lobbyists the tobacco companies have declined and the multi billion dollar video game industry has replaced them providing our Washington representation with their own biased psychology studies claiming violence in movies and video games has no affect on children. The first mass shooting occurred in 1975 and is increasing around the world even in countries where gun ownership is a crime.

As I work security today I find some down time to read. I am reading "Assasination Generation" by Lt. Col. Dave Grossman. For the military he was also a psychologist. Interestingly through training we have increased the willingness of our soldiers to use their weapons, but in the right situations. Today's video games are nearly identical, but give points for kills with little restraint.

Anyway if your interested this is the book:

 

[shorthairsrus]

voting for arming the staff??? --- i have to ask what school did you go to????


the school i went to - back in the eighties we had crazy kids -- that would attack physically teachers or principals. This happened several times - one of them attacked the teacher and then when i grabbed the kid through him up against the wall and the principal took over he toppled the principal and i had to jump in again.

The last gotdamn thing i want is a kid attack a teacher and grab the concealed weapon from a teacher.

What is your answer to that. In the situations that i have had first hand -- the teacher had no clue the student was going to do something like that ---- i was like the kid was possessed.

By the way i though the sob against the wall a second time - punched him in the gut over and over smiled at the principal and said here. I would of been a dead man if that teacher or prinicpal would of had a weapon.

That same school (in ND) my kids went too -- we have two or three resource officers armed. They are doing what the principals did back in the day. We still have the same crazy kids. We need to hang the parents is what we need to do. Its time to be not so nice and to hurt somebodys feeling.

Jails---- heat needs to be turned down to 50 degrees, cement floors sprayed with water hourly, dark, no power, no phones, no tv, no excercise. Get the point. Crucifications need to come back --- do em on the prairie in the dead of winter. Life will change in a hurry.

Add to that no withholding - every tax is paid from an individual ------- that will change things even faster. I guarantee it.

 

[martinslanding]

Most schools already have a resource officer…make sure this resource officer is armed and trained….trained being the key word. In almost every recent school shooting the system has failed, usually multiple times. Fix the system starting with local government by training and reallocation of funds towards school protection … Athletic programs that get all the funding might have to wait in line while protection policies are funded … a change in thinking and culture but it’s what needs to be done. Hold each community responsible for their own schools and children….there is no blanket country wide fix.

 

[Chas'n Tail]

I've found it interesting at how many people support arming the teacher. I'm not saying it's wrong, i'm just surprised. I honestly can't say if I would trust some of my coworkers with a leathal weapon, and i'm sure some would say the same thing about me. Let me ask you this. Would you be comfortable letting your child be in a school with a teacher with a gun? Would you support being able to conceal carry in your place of business knowing others are doing the same thing? Once again, let me state that I'm not necessarily disagreeing with the opinion, I just think it brings up more questions that would have to be asked and answered if that's the direction we decided to go.

 

[NDSportsman]

A monitored entrance for one. Maybe even a buzz in system, I mean they put them on every damn apartment building now days why not schools. An armed security guard or resource officer would also be a good idea. Qualified staff members should be allowed to carry as well.

 

[Allen]

The problem with having an armed security guard is that each and every nut job out there who wants to attack a school will already know who and where the guard is located at specific times of the day. Then they just have to target that person first.

You would need multiple guards in order to provide adequate security, that way the psychos will have more than one armed target to worry about.

 

[zoops]

Only problem I see with the monitored entrance idea is that many schools, especially high schools, have many entrance points. Yeah, there might only be one that's unlocked during the day but it wouldn't be hard for them to prop a door open.

 

[NDSportsman]

I took an eight hour training symposium on the subject of church and school security just two weeks ago. Timely I guess. They estimate that half the cost of building a school is to meet fire code even though no child has died in a school fire for 50 years. Your right this is not a gun problem it is a behavior problem. These mass killers are desensitized to death and creatures of opportunity. This demands a two pronged solution. First and immediately eliminate our schools as soft targets. Laminated glass in doors, metal detectors, and trained armed people inside the school.

Today when we talk about lobbyists the tobacco companies have declined and the multi billion dollar video game industry has replaced them providing our Washington representation with their own biased psychology studies claiming violence in movies and video games has no affect on children. The first mass shooting occurred in 1975 and is increasing around the world even in countries where gun ownership is a crime.

As I work security today I find some down time to read. I am reading "Assasination Generation" by Lt. Col. Dave Grossman. For the military he was also a psychologist. Interestingly through training we have increased the willingness of our soldiers to use their weapons, but in the right situations. Today's video games are nearly identical, but give points for kills with little restraint.

Yeah you can't tell me that watching or playing gore for hours on end doesn't have some affect. Especially on individuals with a mental issue already. Some of these people are like zombies already with the fricking drugs(both legal and illegal) they are on now days.

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Only problem I see with the monitored entrance idea is that many schools, especially high schools, have many entrance points. Yeah, there might only be one that's unlocked during the day but it wouldn't be hard for them to prop a door open.

They should be able to install some type of electric system that shows when a door is open. Christ your car is constantly telling us now days. Technology is out there it's time to start using it.

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The problem with having an armed security guard is that each and every nut job out there who wants to attack a school will already know who and where the guard is located at specific times of the day. Then they just have to target that person first.

You would need multiple guards in order to provide adequate security, that way the psychos will have more than one armed target to worry about.

Well that's the deal they don't want to deal with someone who could shoot back so I think it's somewhat of a deterrent at least. It would be nice to have multiple security measures in place. Don't just rely on one stop gap.

 

[shorthairsrus]

A monitored entrance for one. Maybe even a buzz in system, I mean they put them on every damn apartment building now days why not schools. An armed security guard or resource officer would also be a good idea. Qualified staff members should be allowed to carry as well.

My school has armed resource officer - actually 5 of them - one is onsite all the time.
Buzzing them in ???? are you serious --- we have 10k total students; high school has 1500 kids each -- -- your going to buzz in 1500 kids using a apartment type buzzer. I dont think so.

Come on ---- lets seriously talk about the solution.

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The problem with having an armed security guard is that each and every nut job out there who wants to attack a school will already know who and where the guard is located at specific times of the day. Then they just have to target that person first.

You would need multiple guards in order to provide adequate security, that way the psychos will have more than one armed target to worry about.

We have had a cop in our school - since i was a kid armed never an issue with targeting. The kid in FL didnt target the cop.

 

[NDSportsman]

My school has armed resource officer - actually 5 of them - one is onsite all the time.
Buzzing them in ???? are you serious --- we have 10k total students; high school has 1500 kids each -- -- your going to buzz in 1500 kids using a apartment type buzzer. I dont think so.

Come on ---- lets seriously talk about the solution.

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We have had a cop in our school - since i was a kid armed never an issue with targeting. The kid in FL didnt target the cop.

The entrance could be open during the usual start time without the buzzer system. Have a person monitoring the access is what I'm saying. You are gonna notice someone walking in with an AR. Why do people have to make this so complicated.

 

[shorthairsrus]

The entrance could be open during the usual start time without the buzzer system. Have a person monitoring the access is what I'm saying. You are gonna notice someone walking in with an AR. Why do people have to make this so complicated.

School in FL with the shooting had that and a resource officer on site ---- the doors opened as you say start time and "ending time" - hence the kid walked in.

We have the same process in our school --- no different.




Easy is what most people want to do -- take away rights of everybody else to solve a problem.

I am not targeting you on this sportsman -- i am just saying in general.

 

[Stan's Dad]

dont ya dare touch my vidya games

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i like killing nazis via PS4

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maybe we should come up with some sort of rating system for movies and video games so people know what might or might not be age appropriate.... err wait what?

 

[AR-15]

Your the Staff, armed with a 380, 9mm, etc, and you got some madman coming at you with a shotgun, AR-15 or a AK, your going to be shit out of luck, use security guards in the building with handguns and their backup shotgun or rifle right next to them

 

[martinslanding]

Your the Staff, armed with a 380, 9mm, etc, and you got some madman coming at you with a shotgun, AR-15 or a AK, your going to be shit out of luck, use security guards in the building with handguns and their backup shotgun or rifle right next to them

A trained individual with a loaded firearm against punk kid how has never shot real life weapon … I will take my chances with trained marksman ….

 

[Kurtr]

voting for arming the staff??? --- i have to ask what school did you go to????


the school i went to - back in the eighties we had crazy kids -- that would attack physically teachers or principals. This happened several times - one of them attacked the teacher and then when i grabbed the kid through him up against the wall and the principal took over he toppled the principal and i had to jump in again.

The last gotdamn thing i want is a kid attack a teacher and grab the concealed weapon from a teacher.

What is your answer to that. In the situations that i have had first hand -- the teacher had no clue the student was going to do something like that ---- i was like the kid was possessed.

By the way i though the sob against the wall a second time - punched him in the gut over and over smiled at the principal and said here. I would of been a dead man if that teacher or prinicpal would of had a weapon.

That same school (in ND) my kids went too -- we have two or three resource officers armed. They are doing what the principals did back in the day. We still have the same crazy kids. We need to hang the parents is what we need to do. Its time to be not so nice and to hurt somebodys feeling.

Jails---- heat needs to be turned down to 50 degrees, cement floors sprayed with water hourly, dark, no power, no phones, no tv, no excercise. Get the point. Crucifications need to come back --- do em on the prairie in the dead of winter. Life will change in a hurry.

Add to that no withholding - every tax is paid from an individual ------- that will change things even faster. I guarantee it.

Where did you go to school in south central with eazy e and ice cube? I went to a fairly big high school graduated in 1997 with 400 other kids and we still brought guns to school to redo the stocks in wood shop and never had teachers getting attacked.

If it is a concealed weapon no one will know it is there why would anyone be dead in a situation like that. Its not like jackie chan just grabs the gun and goes to work...

 

[JayKay]

I graduated in 1988, from Bismarck High School, and while there were fights, I don't recall seeing any kids attack teachers. If they had, I think well over 95% of the parents would have been for tossing the kid in jail. Truly..

I think if you think it's normal for kids to attack a teacher or principal, then the pendulum has swung too far. If that's "normal" then we failed long ago. The answer to this has to be stiffer penalties. Assault is already illegal. Murder is already illegal.

When I say penalties, I mean fines and serving time. A person who is broke isn't going to pay a fine. Make jail or penitentiary time bad enough, and people won't commit crimes to get locked up. Believe it or not, some do.

Within the past year, I have toured both the new jail in Bismarck, as well as the ND Penitentiary. While I wouldn't want to live at either, it's obvious that the penalties are not a strong enough deterrent.

Don't even get me started on legalizing drugs...

 

[gst]

Your the Staff, armed with a 380, 9mm, etc, and you got some madman coming at you with a shotgun, AR-15 or a AK, your going to be shit out of luck, use security guards in the building with handguns and their backup shotgun or rifle right next to them

After the Florida shooting there was a video on the news of the "active shooter" drill and classroom response. The students tipped the desks on their side, huddled in a group in the corner and held text books up in front of their heads.

As a last resort along with armed guards, I would prefer a TRAINED teacher even with a .380 over Shakespeare's Tale of Two Cities between my child and a shooter.