2019 ND Legislature and ND Sportsmens Etree

[Fritz the Cat]

How many tags are allotted to outfitters? I'm not a big fan of running guys out of business. How big of issue is it?

A few years ago it was five. As an outfitter, I was contacted by Game and Fish. I declined. That would have been a fucking wreck. I would guess very few outfitters purchase the five tags and then resell them with a hunt. Not worth it.

 

[Meelosh]

Alright. Let's say 5 still stands. How many outfitters are there in operation in ND? I'm looking for total allotted tags to outfitters for the purpose of selling a wild deer hunt.

 

[Davey Crockett]

A few years ago it was five. As an outfitter, I was contacted by Game and Fish. I declined. That would have been a fucking wreck. I would guess very few outfitters purchase the five tags and then resell them with a hunt. Not worth it.

Are you talking whitetail rifle tags ? it varies year by year but a maximum of 100 , Then it's broken down by units and in my unit the maximum was 5 in the good years when there were a lot of deer and 3 or 4 later on and they are on a lottery . Pretty sure you know this but for those that don't , Those tags are $ 250 a piece and the outfitter license is another $ 250 and in order to apply you need proof of insurance which was $ 1600 per year but insurance companies will let you make two payments and will provide proof of insurance so you can figure $ 1300 just to get you in the lottery for outfitter licenses and you hope like hell you get drawn. Then to top that off there are the antis with unlimited funds that will go through all that just to burn the tags and because the tags are transferable some stoop low enough to contact the outfitters and offer the tags for sale. My last year of outfitting I wrote out a check for $ 800 for one tag. The icing on that cake is I was outfitting only on my own property , Not leased, Mine that I pay the taxes on. That is my lesson for the day to you guys that think every outfitter is stealing "your" deer.

 

[Meelosh]

100 total tags that every outfitter in the state needs to split among themselves? Am I reading that correctly?

 

[Davey Crockett]

Maximum of 100, I am sure it's less now with more competition for tags and less deer/habitat. They supposedly have some fancy formula that dictates how many tags they will let go.to outfitters.

 

[espringers]

ya. its a shit show and its a drop in the bucket. most outfitters that i am aware of guide on tags applied for and granted through the regular process.

 

[ndlongshot]

How many tags are allotted to outfitters? I'm not a big fan of running guys out of business. How big of issue is it?

Why? They have no issue running you off all the property you used to hunt until they leased it? I dont need the government (or at the hands of other hunters sacrificing) subsidizing deer tags for "economic development". All they do is markup those tags and sell to non residents, and turn around and lease more land. Its BS. You and I can't transfer tags, but they can?! Give me a break...

I agree, outfitters deserve nothing. All they do is make it harder for locals to hunt. If they have clients who draw tags in the lottery by all means guide them on a hunt. But what makes them so special that they get a handful to sell to the highest bidder.

 

[Meelosh]

Because its apparently not that big of issue to begin with, at least as far as deer hunting operations go. And, as being someone that has had their livelihood taken from them and am now a small business owner myself, I'm careful about taking money out of peoples pockets.

 

[Davey Crockett]

A few years ago it was five. As an outfitter, I was contacted by Game and Fish. I declined. That would have been a fucking wreck. I would guess very few outfitters purchase the five tags and then resell them with a hunt. Not worth it.

It made me chuckle that they would call an outfitter and offer to sell tags. At a regional meeting a NDGF rep said "We hate guides and outfitters" I forget who it was and it doesn't matter as long as he was speaking for the department. One thing for certain is they like the money from them though.

 

[Davey Crockett]

NDGF does a lot of great things, I'm not necessarily bashing them just calling a beet a beet .

 

[Fritz the Cat]

It made me chuckle that they would call an outfitter and offer to sell tags. At a regional meeting a NDGF rep said "We hate guides and outfitters" I forget who it was and it doesn't matter as long as he was speaking for the department. One thing for certain is they like the money from them though.

It wasn't a call on the phone. I believe I was standing at the window paying $300 bucks for an outfitters license and the clerk told me about the tags at $250 dollars times 5. It didn't take me two seconds to say no thanks.

There are many rules to become an outfitter. Back when we were grandfathered in but today you have to work as a guide for a year or two before you can have an outfitters license. An outfitter must have $5 million dollars in insurance. Be current or certified in CPR. If you are hunting waterfowl and roaming between many landowners you will need to report who's land and date. You also have to pay an extra $200 to Game and Fish because they record your reporting. (sound like fun yet) If you are hunting birds there is no party hunting and all birds must be kept separate. When the birds are cleaned and stored, the guys can't leave for town while the outfitter has all the birds stored. Unless all birds are marked with the license number of each hunter.

At the end of the day when everyone goes to town to drink beer, you the outfitter is sorting, cleaning, packaging and boxing each individuals fish or birds or whatever.

I dropped my license. On the flip side I have no regrets. Made a lot of good friends and met some people that were great and some plane ass different. 90% were Republicans and only had 4 sportsmen in 12 years who were die hard democrats. The demographics was interesting. Welders, post office workers, electricians, farmers but never ever a United Auto Worker or other Union worker types. You know the ones....at work they talk about pussy and at the bar they talk about work.

 

[Davey Crockett]

Dropped mine too. It was fun while it lasted, Just turned into too big of a gamble in the end. Had a few good years but I knew eventually luck would run out and would have been stuck holding the bag.

Meelosh , You summed it up nice when you said........."Because its apparently not that big of issue to begin with, at least as far as deer hunting operations go. And, as being someone that has had their livelihood taken from them and am now a small business owner myself, I'm careful about taking money out of peoples pockets."

- - - Updated - - -

For me it paid the difference between renting out the farmland land VS putting it into a conservation program. It made it so affordable and feasible to put in 200 acres of CRP with food plots and 200 acres of timber surrounding it. It was a win win for all, My surrounding neighbors liked it too. When I contacted NDGF about lifting the regulation to committing the expensive insurance they said contact your reps. I did and he was he was surprised to hear how the system was set up , He was going to contact NDGF about it and get back to me. I never heard a response back.

 

[Petras]

One thing that I would like to see happen is some sort of price reciprocity as far as non resident tags go. I'm sure it would open up a can of worms as far as budget concerns go, but I personally think we should be charging non residents the same price it would cost us if we wanted to go hunt in their state....

 

[Davey Crockett]

can you throw some numbers out there to share ? Iv'e never hunted out of state .

 

[dean nelson]

One thing that I would like to see happen is some sort of price reciprocity as far as non resident tags go. I'm sure it would open up a can of worms as far as budget concerns go, but I personally think we should be charging non residents the same price it would cost us if we wanted to go hunt in their state....

So basically what you're saying here is we should be charging the nonresident that come here less money to come here!

 

[Petras]

a non resident deer tag (the one you need for a buck) is $625 in montana... wyoming - $389.... utah $268 - $568.... New Mexico $283-$368... Arizona $300.... Idaho - $301.... Iowa - $426 gets a buck and a doe tag. Colorado - $396... South Dakota - $286

These are just the costs for the deer permit only. This doesn't include all the other licenses required. Some states require another $150+ just in accompanying licenses to go along with the deer permit... ND charges $255 for a gun tag and $250 for a bow tag and a whopping $22 in extra accompanying licenses.

Dean I don't know what states your talking about, but the ones I've listed are all much more expensive than here to get a tag. The only one that I've looked at that was cheaper was Minnesota.

Perhaps I should have worded it differently, $250 minimum, or = to the cost of the applicants home state NR deer permit price.

 

[Davey Crockett]

The only can of worms that would pose is more money for another boat access or two. NDGF does a good job in the fishery side of things but as far as the hunting end , They do OK with they have to work with but there is room for improvement. It's easier to manage the fisheries than the than wild game herd.

 

[Fly Carpin]

So basically what you're saying here is we should be charging the nonresident that come here less money to come here!

Swing and a miss

 

[Davey Crockett]

Swing and a miss

That was a checked swing on a bad pitch.

 

[dean nelson]

Swing and a miss

No it's not carp humper. He purposely skipped the two states where the vast majority of our nonresident Hunters come from Minnesota and Wisconsin! MN is $185 and wi is $165! Who cares what Montana and Wyoming charge their people don't come here to hunt in any great numbers. Wisconsin and Minnesota provide the vast vast majority of our nonresident Hunters thus the reason why this policy would be pointless and would in fact and could quite possibly cause an increase!!

The swing and the miss here was once again you!