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    1. Back To Top    #1
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      Shop/man cave project

      Well, started a man cave project and with covid killing summer I am going all in solo. So far I have a 40x52 dug out and moving gravel. I am using ez forms and was wondering if anyone has experience with “helix” additive in the cement instead of laying rebar?

      I made the decision to spend more on material and do it myself vs labor, some days I feel like that was a mistake, but love that it will be made by me.

      Sips walls
      ez forms and floor heat
      rafters, blow insulation, and steel roof - interior and exterior
      bathroom, septic - code sucks on this and may just do holding tank🤫.
      floor drains
      bar

      any ideas or mistakes made for list above let me know.

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    2. Back To Top    #2
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      are you going to do insulation yourself or hire it out?

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      Floor heat: Are you running tubing for a boiler, or going electrical? Also, if you have a bar, will you be running water there? Might not be a bad idea to do something like a combi-boiler to run both your floor heat and have hot water at the tap. Also, consider hanging a unit heater to supplement. The floor heat should be enough on most days, but if it's really cold having that heater to take the edge off will help. Plus you can keep it at 50-55 all fall/winter, and crank it when you're planning to use the space. A shop heater heats much more quickly than a floor heating system.

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      Code/inspector will probably dictate your use of rebar in

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    5. Back To Top    #5
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      Quote Originally Posted by Dad View Post
      Well, started a man cave project and with covid killing summer I am going all in solo. So far I have a 40x52 dug out and moving gravel. I am using ez forms and was wondering if anyone has experience with “helix” additive in the cement instead of laying rebar?

      I made the decision to spend more on material and do it myself vs labor, some days I feel like that was a mistake, but love that it will be made by me.

      Sips walls
      ez forms and floor heat
      rafters, blow insulation, and steel roof - interior and exterior
      bathroom, septic - code sucks on this and may just do holding tank狼.
      floor drains
      bar

      any ideas or mistakes made for list above let me know.
      Helix is junk stay with the rebar and you won't be sorry

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      I don't always get negative reps..... But when I do it's because some crybaby couldn't handle my posts!

    6. Back To Top    #6
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      Quote Originally Posted by Duckslayer100 View Post
      Floor heat: Are you running tubing for a boiler, or going electrical? Also, if you have a bar, will you be running water there? Might not be a bad idea to do something like a combi-boiler to run both your floor heat and have hot water at the tap. Also, consider hanging a unit heater to supplement. The floor heat should be enough on most days, but if it's really cold having that heater to take the edge off will help. Plus you can keep it at 50-55 all fall/winter, and crank it when you're planning to use the space. A shop heater heats much more quickly than a floor heating system.
      If you need to to be more than 55 degrees in a shop, you don't need a shop, you need a knitting nook.

      - - - Updated - - -

      If you used any of the online design tools, double the lighting, shadows suck donkey-balls when you're trying to work. Triple the outlets, you may find that you move stuff around vs. you original plan, having power where you need it is CHEAP up front. In a shop that size I'd probably have at least 4 50Amp plugs, you may not have 4 devices that need 220V power, but, it's nice to have the power and therefore the device where you need it vs. where an outlet will allow it. 6-8 outlets in the ceiling w/drop-down/retractable extension cords.

      Assuming you'll have a compressor, I'd have air plumbed to both ends with at least 50' of air-hose on a reel @ either end. Assuming you'll have an overhead door, 100' of air-hose @ that end isn't a bad plan so you can use compressed air outside when/if you need it.

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    7. Back To Top    #7
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      Quote Originally Posted by Dad View Post
      Well, started a man cave project and with covid killing summer I am going all in solo. So far I have a 40x52 dug out and moving gravel. I am using ez forms and was wondering if anyone has experience with “helix” additive in the cement instead of laying rebar?

      I made the decision to spend more on material and do it myself vs labor, some days I feel like that was a mistake, but love that it will be made by me.

      Sips walls
      ez forms and floor heat
      rafters, blow insulation, and steel roof - interior and exterior
      bathroom, septic - code sucks on this and may just do holding tank狼.
      floor drains
      bar

      any ideas or mistakes made for list above let me know.
      helix as in fiber mesh. In walls I would not use it. In the floor i have no problem using it

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    8. Back To Top    #8
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      All good ideas above. Outlets, air, or anything that is inside the walls os much cheaper to install now versus after the walls are finished. Agree that floor heat at 55 degrees is good for a shop. But if you walk in and want the heat warmer that floor heat is going to take quite awhile to get to 70. Most things that you put off to add later will cost more later.

      Makes me want to build one myself.

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      I plan to use a house furnace so I can add ac in future in addition to floor heat, running tubes and propane burner. I don’t knit but need to get above 65 at times for curing some adhesives for the ice house business. The sips panels are already insulated and plan to blow in the ceiling myself. Agree with lights and outlets and have a plan for water at the bar as it is next to the bathroom. I am curious on more detail on helix additive besides it being junk, it meets code at 10lbs per yard of concrete in North Dakota.

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    10. Back To Top    #10
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      Quote Originally Posted by Dad View Post
      I plan to use a house furnace so I can add ac in future in addition to floor heat, running tubes and propane burner. I don’t knit but need to get above 65 at times for curing some adhesives for the ice house business.
      You get a special exception for actually NEEDING the heat.

      AC is an oft-overlooked but very necessary function within a shop IMO, especially for keeping humidity down. Steel things are less prone to rust. Powder and primers keep indefinitely in a climate controlled environment.

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    11. Back To Top    #11
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      Quote Originally Posted by Dad View Post
      I plan to use a house furnace so I can add ac in future in addition to floor heat, running tubes and propane burner. I don’t knit but need to get above 65 at times for curing some adhesives for the ice house business. The sips panels are already insulated and plan to blow in the ceiling myself. Agree with lights and outlets and have a plan for water at the bar as it is next to the bathroom. I am curious on more detail on helix additive besides it being junk, it meets code at 10lbs per yard of concrete in North Dakota.

      i have used it on alot of projects but on floors or suspended floors. Footings and walls i would use rebar as it is really not that labor intensive and i think works better in those applications. What does the ready mix company sell it for per bag as it comes in 10 pound bags and needs to be added while batching. If you add it after you end up with big balls of fiber mesh it is not distributed evenly through out the mix and serves no purpose.

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    12. Back To Top    #12
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      Unless your related to FLASH your not blowing the insulation yourself.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Dad View Post
      I plan to use a house furnace so I can add ac in future in addition to floor heat, running tubes and propane burner. I don’t knit but need to get above 65 at times for curing some adhesives for the ice house business. The sips panels are already insulated and plan to blow in the ceiling myself. Agree with lights and outlets and have a plan for water at the bar as it is next to the bathroom. I am curious on more detail on helix additive besides it being junk, it meets code at 10lbs per yard of concrete in North Dakota.
      is this a floating slab or do you have a 4' foundation?

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      Quote Originally Posted by SDMF View Post
      If you need to to be more than 55 degrees in a shop, you don't need a shop, you need a knitting nook.
      50-55 is typically the lowest recommended setting for a unit heater per manufacture spec. But ok there big shoots, thanks for the constructive insight. I'm sure it helped big time.

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    15. Back To Top    #15
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      I wouldn’t call it a shop, but my man cave sits at 67-68 all winter. My nat gas bill is minimal, so why not walk into a nice temp building to work on your stuff? I go in an out often so it would cycle a lot with big temp swings.

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    16. Back To Top    #16
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      The fiber mesh for the floor in my opinion leaves a not so pleasant "finish." You can see the fibers plain as day. I would stay away from it and use a good concrete sealer for the floor at least that is what I did when I built mine.

      Also an electric winch on the ceiling has been one of the most handiest "tools" I installed as well. From hanging deer to working on sleds and atv's, it's been a back saver.

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      Last edited by Ruttin; 05-13-2020 at 09:08 AM.

    17. Back To Top    #17
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      First question is where do you live?
      Definitely go rebar, don't try to go the easy quick route. Rebar takes such little time and is worth its weight in gold.
      Foam closed cell insulation in the walls. Blow in up in the ceiling is fine.
      As stated plenty of outlets and floor drains.
      Plan on where you might put in meat freezers or other cabinets in case you want to plug something in.
      Water both hot and cold is great in the shop.
      Do heat and a/c all at once and your done. Did it with ours and so glad we did.
      We also went 12' walls with 10' high doors just in case. Have a 20'x10' door on the double stall and on the 40' single stall lane we have a 14'x10' on each end of the long stall. Comes in handy and glad we put in the 2 doors on that stall.
      Plenty of LED overhead lights. Also had them wire in for our cabinets and over head cabinets so we could put LED lights under the cabinets with each having separate switch for working on the bench.
      Don't forget to wire in for overhead fans with wall switches to each one.
      I know i am forgetting some things.
      Our builder and electrician down here kept saying this is over kill on the things we done. Since we built our builder and electrician have brought many clients over to look at our setup and most have gone this route after seeing it and how handy it is. While we were doing it they kept telling us you aren't in ND anymore and i would just tell them what keeps you warm in the winter will keep you cool in the summer.
      Not for everyone and just my 2 cents so good luck!

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    18. Back To Top    #18
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      I would use rebar no matter what. I don't feel that fiber does anything close to what rebar does. I think there are applications for it but it does not replace rebar in it. I also agree with the finishing aspect, it makes it more difficult and is visible. Assuming you are burning the floor out with a power trowel, I certainly would not use it.

      Make sure you insulate your slab properly from the outside. People seem to forget all the heat loss they can get from the outside. 2" foam up the exterior of the slab/thick edge is needed. You'll have to get a flashing bent for the top of it but it keeps a lot of loss from occurring.

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      I am going floating slab, not sure everyone knows what helix is but it is metal fill additive, about like a box of nails you add to concrete. I am up the hill from Fargo so clay and grave base. I am going 12” gravel under slab. I am going two 10x12 doors on end wall with 12ft ceiling. One lane for boats and other for ice gear. I would go deeper but space didn’t allow.

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      Put poly under your slab, its a cheap way to reduce any moisture from wicking up through the slab.

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