Piping Mississippi River water west

[lunkerslayer]

There has been some discussions on this very plan, kind of reminds me of the same dilemma happening here in North Dakota.
https://www.desertsun.com/story/opin...ay/7708419001/

[Allen]

This idea has been bantered about since the 1980s. Let us not forget just how politically powerful the states that would benefit from this are in Congress, just in case one immediately defaults to "it won't happen".

One thing that is just plain stupid in that article is the mere mentioning of California should do more desalination because of rising sea levels, or how diverting water from the Mississippi would somehow help prevent flooding along the lower Mississippi, or again that diverting Mississippi water would help slow the rising sea levels. The math just isn't on the side of that idiot.

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Just to name a few states where this idea would be popular in the political circles would include: Colorado, Wyoming, Idaho, Oregon, California, Utah, Nevada, and Arizona. One might also be able to easily tack on Nebraska, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas and New Mexico. All of these states have water compacts with their neighbors that could be reworked in favor of those who don't get Mississippi water delivered to their doors. That's an awful lot of votes in Congress.

[measure-it]

If you live where YOU feel it's too dry.....MOVE!

[sl1000794]

[QUOTE=
One thing that is just plain stupid in that article is the mere mentioning of California should do more desalination because of rising sea levels.[/QUOTE]

Rising sea levels ... what a joke. I launched out to the Pacific Ocean from the mid-80's thru 2015. The difference between the high/high to low/low tide can exceed 8'+. Combine that with a swell that can exceed 8 feet how in hell can an inch or 2 of ocean rise make a difference ... plus where is all this water come from???

[ORCUS DEMENS]

SL Ocean level rise is two fold, unusually rapid ice melt globally, and warmer water occupies a larger volume. Measure it has a point. The southwest has seen enormous population growth since the seventies. Water decisions in this part of the country were made based on "current" conditions. This area experienced the wettest hundred years in geological history during this period. If you look at current population shifts, the Great Lakes region (Rust Belt) is seeing population growth. Due to the Great Lakes Compact, water from this basin can not be moved outside the basin. If states adjoining the Mighty Mississippi do not enact a similar resolution, a wealthy private entity will figure a way to divert this resource.

[Rowdie]

Mark my words....It's a very bad idea to pipe water across a continental divide!!! Just don't do it!!

[Allen]

Rising sea levels ... what a joke. I launched out to the Pacific Ocean from the mid-80's thru 2015. The difference between the high/high to low/low tide can exceed 8'+. Combine that with a swell that can exceed 8 feet how in hell can an inch or 2 of ocean rise make a difference ... plus where is all this water come from???

Polar ice caps, Greenland, receding glaciers, etc.

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If you live where YOU feel it's too dry.....MOVE!

Personally, I'd like to keep the Californiacators west of Vegas, at a minimum.

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SL Ocean level rise is two fold, unusually rapid ice melt globally, and warmer water occupies a larger volume. Measure it has a point. The southwest has seen enormous population growth since the seventies. Water decisions in this part of the country were made based on "current" conditions. This area experienced the wettest hundred years in geological history during this period. If you look at current population shifts, the Great Lakes region (Rust Belt) is seeing population growth. Due to the Great Lakes Compact, water from this basin can not be moved outside the basin. If states adjoining the Mighty Mississippi do not enact a similar resolution, a wealthy private entity will figure a way to divert this resource.

I'm pretty sure it won't be a private entity. No way they could navigate/fund the environmental studies this would require, much less fund the construction of something that would involve eminent domain of so much land. Nah, this would be a Corps of Engineers, or Bureau of Reclamation style project. Most likely a Reclamation project with a Corps permit since Reclamation owns the dams on the Colorado River into which the water would go and the Corps mostly manages the Mississippi.

As far as the Great Lakes pact, that is simply a pact between the states to oppose any project that were to divert Great Lakes water out of the Great Lakes watershed. It doesn't have the weight of federal law, which is what would be required to divert water from the Mississippi to the Colorado.

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Mark my words....It's a very bad idea to pipe water across a continental divide!!! Just don't do it!!

Mehh, we do it all the time. Minnetucky moves water around quite a bit in between different watersheds. There's a Milk River diversion that takes water from the Missouri watershed into the Hudson's Bay watershed. All kinds of water diversions exist in this country. When you really think about it, water is just another resource/commodity. Why we think it's any different than oil, coal, iron, copper, wheat, or cars escapes my logic. We are irrationally attached to water because it has multiple uses (drinking, beer making, fishing, etc), but at the end of the day...water moves in the direction of money.

[tikka243]

A wise man once told me, whiskey is for drinking and water is for fighting. In this instance that is true

[PrairieGhost]

Mehh, we do it all the time. Minnetucky moves water around quite a bit in between different watersheds. There's a Milk River diversion that takes water from the Missouri watershed into the Hudson's Bay watershed. All kinds of water diversions exist in this country. When you really think about it, water is just another resource/commodity. Why we think it's any different than oil, coal, iron, copper, wheat, or cars escapes my logic. We are irrationally attached to water because it has multiple uses (drinking, beer making, fishing, etc), but at the end of the day...water moves in the direction of money.

In my home town the Sheyenne river goes to Hudson Bay, and ten miles away the James river goes to the Gulf of Mexico. Its less than 100 feet of elevation to move water over that continental divide. Do we even have pumps with the pressure and volume that would be required to move water from the Mississippi to the west? We sure are not ditching it.

[Allen]

Actually, yes...it would be a canal to get water into the Colorado River. The pumps to get water over the hills and into California can be found at Lake Havasu just above Parker Dam.

Have you never noticed Snake Creek Pumping Plant right here in ND? If I remember correctly it's around 2,000 cfs.

[wjschmaltz]

The southwest has seen enormous population growth since the seventies. Water decisions in this part of the country were made based on "current" conditions. .

My wife drug me down to Scottsdale area this last winter and I was very perplexed about the water situation so I did a deep dive. It's actually amazing to me that they still let everyone have a pool in their yard.

Step one is cut off water to everyone's personal pool. Step two (which should be done simultaneously with step 1) would be cut off people that think they need to water lawns and landscaping. You live in the desert you bozos, no green for you! Maybe that's a drop in the bucket, I don't know. But it can't hurt. Then let it shake out a bit. See how much that alone keeps in the reservoirs and then and only then can the conversation be had about moving water.

It is quite the conundrum. They live there so I want to say that it's their problem, but I'd rather ship them goobers in those states water to keep them there than have them all move to the midwest.

[WormWiggler]

Is water destroyed at any point in any of the uses? I recall a cycle diagraphm, condensation, precipitation and all that.. But does any process break the actual water down to useless or detrimental form?

[PrairieGhost]

Allen how high in elevation woukd you need to pump to reach the Colorado? I dont think you can dig that deep to trench to it. I first see the Colorado coming out of Shadow Mountain lake when I head south out of Rocky Mountain National Park. I am not familiar with access that woukd not require at least 3000 ft in elevation. I suppose they could pump in stages, but trench??????

was Our oldest son lived in Chandler for a few years. We coukd not believe that some neighborhoods had artificial lakes large enough for power boats and water ski jumps. Years ago doctors woukd send people to the Phoenix are because their health was better in dry climates. Now the humidity is right up there with ours. My son would listen to the morning humidity report to see if he coukd use his swamp air conditioner that day. In winter you had to listen to air quality reports to see if you coukd run your wood fireplace.

[sl1000794]

Polar ice caps are floating ice, so if all of it melted sea level would not change.

[johnr]

Polar ice caps are floating ice, so if all of it melted sea level would not change.

I had a whiskey water last night, or maybe a bunch of them, and the ice melted in the one I didn't finish, and I had to call servepro this morning and have all the water sucked out of the basement.

[LBrandt]

According to the new government green I dont think they make electric pumps big enough to handle that and run cars at the sametime. LB

[ORCUS DEMENS]

Allen Great Lakes Compact is an international treaty no strictly within the states. SL, yes the ice floating in the Arctic Ocean would not change as it is floating. Greenland ice sheet and Antarctic ice sheets are on land. Now lets all go fishing and enjoy iced beer.

[KDM]

Pumping water, ditching water, and just plain moving water takes LOTS of energy. Energy costs money. Who's going to pay the bill to construct, operate, and maintain this whatever? Legislatures can't figure out where to have lunch without taking 6 months of committee meetings, an all hands on deck assembly, and a governors decree let alone figure out who's going to get the most benefit from a water pipe and who should pay more. Then we get to the "WE HAVE TO RAISE TAXES TO PAY FOR IT....." game. That should go over like a lead balloon given the current inflation situations for the average schmoe. My money is on "It's not going to happen." Carry On!

[AR-15]

Shut the dam water off at Hoover Dam and let it full up again, piss on California they can get their own water from the Pacific, if they would shut the dam Welfare off they could build the plants to make fresh water

[sl1000794]

I had a whiskey water last night, or maybe a bunch of them, and the ice melted in the one I didn't finish, and I had to call servepro this morning and have all the water sucked out of the basement.

I think if you had used the toilet instead of the basement there wouldn't have been a basement full of water.