Bha North Dakota chairman

Bfishn

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Uncle Jimbo - What are BHA's thoughts on the ability of ranchers to post the state school land, effectively locking hunters out of public ground we all own? Has BHA ever looked into, or gotten involved in trying to open these up, or is BHA just primarily focused on the grasslands of ND?
 


Whisky

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A friend alerted me to this thread as I don't log in here much anymore. I am a founding board member of the ND Chapter of BHA. I am proud of the group we've assembled and what we've been able to accomplish in a relatively short amount of time. I'm not here to defend Brock and what he said on Rokslide. The words he used were way out of line and I was disappointed when I read it.

That being said there seems to be some clarification that can be made about the signs we put up in the "non-motorized" portions of the Dakota Prairie Grasslands.

Thanks for the clarification. I see no issues with what you guys did, in regards to the signs. I don't feel one should be able to drive through every draw in the Grasslands.
 

JMF

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Sorry for the long winded post. I'm going to make a whiskey drink and smile while I look at my ammo said:
powder and primer cache like any freedom loving red-blooded American and chuckle while thinking of those who find themselves under supplied during the current shortages. [/COLOR]
(Those who know me know that isn't a stretch of truth)

That's all fine and dandy, but how much money did BHA at the national level chip in for the sign project? Did BHA just provide the free labor? What I'm saying is and what I said when this topic came up before is: Why do you have to belong to a national organization to do good things at a local level? Specifically an organization that is helping push an agenda/administration that forces us to hord ammo.
 

Dirty

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I was young and dumb longer than most. Dumber than most too, I fully admit. I threw in an 18 pack most nights rather than a 6.
None of that made me find a thrill in vandalism so I guess I won’t ever understand the sign shooting.

Reminds me a little of the idiots burning down their neighborhood grocery stores and throwing bricks through windows.
 
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Uncle Jimbo

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Uncle Jimbo - What are BHA's thoughts on the ability of ranchers to post the state school land, effectively locking hunters out of public ground we all own? Has BHA ever looked into, or gotten involved in trying to open these up, or is BHA just primarily focused on the grasslands of ND?

I don't believe we've discussed the issue as a board so we've not looked into it. The ND Dept of State Trust Lands has specific regulations regarding the posting of State Trust Lands. Is there a specific case where the regulations aren't being followed or just an overall sentiment that State Trust Lands shouldn't be posted? Feel free to PM me if you'd like.
 

Bfishn

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I don't believe we've discussed the issue as a board so we've not looked into it. The ND Dept of State Trust Lands has specific regulations regarding the posting of State Trust Lands. Is there a specific case where the regulations aren't being followed or just an overall sentiment that State Trust Lands shouldn't be posted? Feel free to PM me if you'd like.

Thanks for the response. I do believe most of the ranchers do technically legally post it but there are certainly many who leave cattle on the land for the sole reason of keeping it posted through deer season. I don't have a problem with the cattle, I just don't think public land in general should be able to be posted. I was just curious if BHA had a position on it considering its public land that hunters are locked out of, and that seems to be one of the main missions of BHA?

With the trespass bills that are constantly being pushed and will likely pass at some point, it seems like its something that should be looked into further. Basically where I hunt the same people that have been pushing for the trespass bill are the same ones that always have the school land posted essentially locking absolutely everything up.
 

Uncle Jimbo

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That's all fine and dandy, but how much money did BHA at the national level chip in for the sign project? Did BHA just provide the free labor? What I'm saying is and what I said when this topic came up before is: Why do you have to belong to a national organization to do good things at a local level? Specifically an organization that is helping push an agenda/administration that forces us to hord ammo.

ZERO, ZILCH, NADA!

All signs and materials were provided by the USFS. The time, sweat, vehicles, gasoline, food and beer (at end of day) were provided by ND BHA members participating in the project. We are 100% volunteer organization at the state level and no funds from "National" or "ND" BHA were used during the signage project.

Having to belong to a national organization is the way national organizations work. I don't always like it but there are some benefits that come with it that aren't always apparent at first. One example being the communications networks that are setup that we can utilize. Example: 2018 ND Legislative session had a couple of bills that could have negatively affected public land access in ND. We were able to utilize an email system that made it easy for us to reach out to ND BHA members and subsequently make it easy for them to reach out to their elected representatives.

There are more benefits than that but that is one example.

That being said, I'm not oblivious to the sentiments of some of the leadership at the national level. Some changes have already been made and more may need to be made in the future. At the end of the day, it is members that can make that change and I know many who've voiced their concerns. I wouldn't be surprised if those member voices helped drive some of those changes.

Try joining just a North Dakota chapter of RMEF, DU, MDF, NRA, AARP, etc without belonging to a "national" org.

If you'd like to start a local public land conservation organization for hunters and anglers I'd be happy to sign up and help out. I mean that sincerely. Being a husband and father of two young children leaves me short on the time and energy required to start one on my own.

Related to that topic, below is a good article. The entire series of articles is very good and worth reading.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/mar...ation-club-is-harder-than-it-seems/ar-BBZ20WL


Part 1: https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/b...bye-critter-group-birth-of-hi-line-sportsmen/
Part 2: https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/b...ter-groups-replaced-local-conservation-clubs/
Part 3: see above
Part 4: https://www.outdoorlife.com/story/blogs/opencountry/whats-next-for-citizen-conservation/
 
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Brocksw

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Brock here. Someone alerted me to this thread as well. I created an account to make 1 post and do not intend on participating any further in this thread.

I stand by what I said. I don't feel it was out of line. You can think or say whatever you'd like about me or what I said. I'm speculating, but I would think most of the critics on this thread and rokslide, are probably guys who also share a distaste for Politically correct culture and pride themselves as being a "straight shooter" or "call it like I see it" kinda a guy. I find it particularly hypocritical for you not to allow me that same freedom and attitude. Of course, everyone likes honesty until you’re honest with them. Then you’re just an asshole.

I didn't put that on a public forum on accident. I didn't put it out there because I lost my cool. It may not have been palatable or easy on the ears, but if we're being honest with each other...we've all heard much worse. Honoring the "straight shooter" attitude I’m sure you guys can appreciate, sometimes you call a spade a spade.

I do represent this Chapter and for the 3 years we've been existence we've put our head down and gone to work. Thousands of volunteer hours spent on things that really aren't that glamorous. Policy issues, comments, letters, agency and governmental processes and meetings that never get talked about. Work projects on a limited budget with limited volunteers. A bunch of guys trying to figure out fundraising in a landscape that possesses no shortage of groups wanting your hard-earned money. It's the nature of the issues we work on and being in this industry. They don't come with shiny signs or awards and we don’t bitch about it. But for anyone to throw our organization in the dirt, I absolutely have a problem with that.

I will absolutely defend the organization and the volunteers on our Board of Directors that carry the load and sacrifice time in the field, time with their kids, time with their wives, summer weekends, vacation time, and money, to do the work they do on behalf of our Chapter and our organization. I will absolutely defend every single member of our Board of Directors and fight back when anyone throws them under the bus. I will absolutely defend the National Organization, that despite its flaws and mistakes, has provided us with support when needed and never told us what to do or how to think. Land Tawney answers each problem I've ever presented him with the same questions, "What can I do to help?", “What do you need from us?”, “What do you guys think?”. He continually tells us, “You know your state best”. Every single time I reach out, he’s there.

Conservation Justice Warriors like my buddy KurtR, seem to have nothing better to do than to sit on web forums tearing down other people’s work. Heaven forbid if someone snaps back to defend themselves or the organization. He can throw stones but seems to have a run and tell my friends complex when someone throws one back.

He's one of many that apparently have nothing better to do. Tearing down our work and our organization with any information they can find that would support their point of view, regardless of source, regardless of nuance, regardless of truth, regardless of the big picture. Chastising the org for every mistake they’ve ever made. Driving prospective members away like they're doing everyone a favor. Promoting all these elaborate conspiracy theories that it's all just this big scam to do.... whatever. It's a bit pathetic and I don't like it. I stated as much. I’m not apologizing for it. That was the basis and context for the comment I made on rokslide. Addressing those individuals who offer nothing but hateful and destructive, self-righteous opinions, shitting on the work others do as volunteers. It’s disgusting.

I do really wonder what good things he or others could do for hunting, fishing, public land, private land, habitat, if they spent as much time working on those things as they did sitting on their phone policing web forums to make sure everyone knows how evil we are.

If you care about hunting and fishing on public lands and keeping those places wild, making sure they are there and in good health for you, for your grandchildren. Making sure they don’t get pummeled into road dust. Then you should absolutely join our organization. We have work to do and we’re one of the organizations leading the fight in those battles in North Dakota. I will gladly work my ass off to prove to you we’re worthy of that $35 bucks a year and you can reach out any time with questions, concerns, ideas, issues, etc. I will be happy to answer or address them to the best of my ability and tirelessly go to work for you and the places we both love.


Just one example of an issue we’re fighting right now. Senator Hoeven wants to gut the Grasslands and put a road in every special place we have in the Badlands via section line rights of way.

We completely stand against the destruction of Section Lines in the Grasslands for more roads. The Grasslands is already 80% “roaded” and the 20% left that is considered Inventoried Roadless Areas, Non-Motorized Areas, areas Suitable for Wilderness, places where you can find solitude and a backcountry experience, away from traffic and modern development, they are under more pressure than ever. We absolutely stand against the development of those areas. We absolutely and unequivocally work to protect them from development to make sure we don’t lose them. We’re not shy about it.

We’re also not hypocrites. Members of our Board of Directors (myself included) and some of our members in general work in the oil industry. It would be hypocritical of us to condemn the same industry that fueled our 4x4 trucks and provided us with 10-ply tires, among all the other petroleum-based products we use while in the backcountry. But that doesn’t mean we need oil development on every ridge top or sage brush bottom. Those Roadless Areas, non-motorized areas, suitable for wilderness areas are damn special places. They’re prime examples of places to just leave alone. There’s room for oil development in the Grasslands. We support that idea. But there are some places that just need to be left alone.

Someday I’ll be fat or old or both and I won’t be able to physically hunt those areas anymore. But that doesn’t mean I’m going to support roads being built in them, taking that backcountry experience away from my son, or his son, or your son, or your son’s son. If you disagree, then yeah, you probably won’t fit or appreciate our organization. If you agree, then there’s no reason for you not to sign up. We might not agree on every issue, but if we can agree on what I just said, we’ll get along just fine.


As Always, Keep It Public
Brock
NDBHA Chairman
 

Kurtr

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I have planted hundreds of trees helped plant acres of crp. Built nesting boxes on waterfowl production areas and helped people get on private land to shoot deer. Put out bales in hard winters. Tangible stuff that is helping wildlife. While local chapters do good stuff its the national board that does not perform. Where were they on the wolf reintroduction in Colorado? Partnering with patagonia who was against the grizzly bear hunts. The redacted tax reports just to many red flags. Look at the miles of fence that the mdf took out and land they got open to hunting. So where do they stand on the bill to make all land posted? As that will affect public land by putting even more people on it. So what access has been opened up in ND by bha?
 


Fritz the Cat

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I went to the Great American Outdoor Show in Harrisburg Pennsylvania in February 2020. The National Rifle Association puts it on. Hunters everywhere. And then there was this little BHA booth. If a gentlemen was 25 or older, they let them pass. If someone passing their booth looked younger than 25, they were after them to sign up. Many unsuspecting young guys did.

The CEO of Backcountry Hunters and Anglers, Land Tawney, likes to sell you a visual that BHA was an idea born around a campfire in Oregon. Not hardly. Land Tawney worked for the National Wildlife Federation for years as a regional director. They have used him to start up many non-profit orgs such as Vanishing Paradise down south to clean up some of the money British Petroleum had to dish out after deep water horizon. And then there is Montana Hunters and Anglers Action which funnels out of State dark money to elect democrat candidates in MT.

Like a bag man Tawney and others like him carry the dark money from Trout Unlimited to Theodore Roosevelt Conservation Partnership to Ducks Unlimited or whatever non-profit controlled opposition org needs it. Remember the Clean Water Conservation Measure just a few years ago trying to divert 5% of oil revenue income away from the ND General Treasury into their coffers. Ducks Unlimited spent $5.4 million.

Some guys on here ask, "why can't we have our own chapter without being affiliated with a national chapter?" Because your $35 dollars won't buy much. These national orgs don't care about your $35 bucks whether they collected it or not. That is not where their income is derived from. What they need is your signature. Once they have it they represent you.

This is Land Tawney:

land-tawney.jpg

The North Dakota BHA has a website. https://www.backcountryhunters.org/north_dakota_chapter_board The Board has profiles and it seems most are biologists or have degrees in wildlife management. However they left out where they work. Why is that important? Well....are they a grassroots sportsmen's org or are they a surrogate controlled opposition org representing the government agencies they work for. One Board of Director that I do know, David Brandt is a biologist with the United States Geological Survey. A federal agency.

They cannot lobby the North Dakota Legislature involving a federal agency in our States Rights Issues. However, they can take their uniforms off and hide within a non-profit made up of 20 year old youngsters and do exactly that.
 
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ndlongshot

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And heres a picture of Fritz...

Tin_foil_hat_2.jpg


"dark money"
"opposition org"
"control"
 

Fritz the Cat

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Ha Ha Ha

Sunlight is still the best antiseptic.

Decades ago tobacco companies targeted "young people" with slick ads.

Years ago Vape companies targeted "young people" with slick flavors.

BHA hosting slick Pint Night targets "..... ......"?
 

Dirty

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After reading through all of these posts I get the impression that the work of the local ND chapter, no matter how beneficial it may be, will always be overshadowed by the politics of the National heads of the organization. It kind of reminds me of people calling for a boycott of a particular store or business because the long since retired CEO doesn’t agree with football players kneeling for the anthem, or maybe he voted for Trump. The anger is at one person or maybe a few, but all of the employees of the store, suppliers of the store, and on down the line get to pay the penalty for an ill-advised, narrow-minded, poorly thought out boycott. It also vaguely reminds me of people throwing bricks through the windows of their neighborhood store before burning it to the ground because a cop in another town treated a person poorly in their eyes.

Obviously these comparisons aren’t equal, but it makes me wonder if you guys hate the ND BHA chapter or if you hate the politics behind the BHA organization as a whole.

I know Uncle Jimbo pretty well. I know his intentions and actions are admirable and are not self-serving. If he says the other guys in the group are good guys also, I’m inclined to believe him. I wonder if the same group of guys got together and did the exact same things, like replacing old, faded, bullet ridden signs and called themselves “the good ol’ boys of ND hunting and fishing club” and had Trump 2020 on all of their hats and never wore masks if you guys would like them a little more.

I’m getting the overall impression the BHA label is what is losing their support more than anything. Of course, in my own personal opinion it doesn’t help when your “chairman” can’t keep his emotions in check and publicly throws out a long-winded, expletive-laden, poorly delivered bitch fest for all to see. Regardless of who he was targeting or why his feeling got hurt, it is a turn off to just about everyone. For many people that was their first impression of BHA and not a good one. For others who were on the fence about joining, they just hopped off the fence and walked away. For others who were members, they are probably face palming out of embarrassment. If the local chapter needed additional support, he just shot them all in the foot. No matter how hard he works and how proud he is, that is piss poor leadership. Originally, I thought maybe his wife served him up too many pink umbrella drinks one night and he started drunk typing but he cleared that up with his one and only Nodak post - he apologizes for nothing and meant everything.

Anyway, to me it seems like a group of people who mean well are going to have to figure out a way to shed the stigma of the founding fathers of their organization to get a foot hold here in ND. There is just too much left-wing and right-wing in everything these days. However, as long as they enjoy what they are doing I haven’t seen any reason to call foul on their actions locally. I think they do need a new spokesman for the group though to replace Mr. Chairman. KurtR has my vote.
 
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Kurtr

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Fritz after belonging to this organization for a year it's clear you have been right all along.

You agreeing with fitz is the mic drops of all mic drops.

- - - Updated - - -

After reading through all of these posts I get the impression that the work of the local ND chapter, no matter how beneficial it may be, will always be overshadowed by the politics of the National heads of the organization. It kind of reminds me of people calling for a boycott of a particular store or business because the long since retired CEO doesn’t agree with football players kneeling for the anthem, or maybe he voted for Trump. The anger is at one person or maybe a few, but all of the employees of the store, suppliers of the store, and on down the line get to pay the penalty for an ill-advised, narrow-minded, poorly thought out boycott. It also vaguely reminds me of people throwing bricks through the windows of their neighborhood store before burning it to the ground because a cop in another town treated a person poorly in their eyes.

Obviously these comparisons aren’t equal, but it makes me wonder if you guys hate the ND BHA chapter or if you hate the politics behind the BHA organization as a whole.

I know Uncle Jimbo pretty well. I know his intentions and actions are admirable. If he says the other guys in the group are good guys also, I’m inclined to believe him. I wonder if the same group of guys got together and did the exact same things, like replacing old, faded, bullet ridden signs and called themselves “the good ol’ ND hunting and fishing club” and had Trump 2020 on all of their hats if you guys would like them a little more.

Im getting the overall impression the BHA label is what is losing their support more than anything. Of course, I’m my own personal opinion it doesn’t help when your “chairman” can’t keep his emotions in check and publicly throws out a long-winded, expletive-laden, poorly delivered bitch fest for all to see. Regardless of who he was targeting, it is a turn off to just about everyone. If the local chapter needed additional support, he just shot them all in the foot. Originally, I thought maybe his wife served him up too many pink umbrella drinks one night but he cleared that up with his one and only Nodak post - he apologized for nothing and meant everything.

Anyway, to me it seems like a group of people who mean well are going to have to figure out a way to shed the stigma of the founding fathers of their organization to get a foot hold here in ND. However, as long as they enjoy what they are doing I haven’t seen any reason to call foul on their actions locally. I think they do need a new spokesman for the group though to replace Mr. Chairman. KurtR has my vote.

I cant i live to far south. I would vote kdm
 

Fritz the Cat

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BHA is a creation of the National Wildlife Federation. A spin off org carrying the very same mission of the NWF to give the appearance of more organizations. Trouble is they can only divide X amount of times before running out of personnel. Board members have to serve back and forth on more than one board.

For instance: David Brandt is currently on the Board of BHA. Before that he was president of the North Dakota Wildlife Federation. Land Tawney used to be regional director for the NWF making several excursions from Montana into North Dakota. Land Tawney and David Brandt know each other very well. Different orgs, same people, same agenda, same boars nest.

When Land Tawney started the org, Montana Sportsmen for Obama, he had to quit the NWF because that would be a conflict of interest. The National Wildlife Federation didn't retire him, they made him CEO of their upstart BHA.

Tawney's regional director spot at NWF was filled by Dave Detloff. He is the guy who brought the Clean Water Measure to ND and filed it with the Secretary of States Office. Dave Brandt became a sponsor of that.

Whenever the shit hits the fan it's always the same ringleaders from the same handful of orgs sitting in a boiler room. The media writes it up sounding like a gymnasium full of young sportsmen were there. They were not and never got a vote.

My prediction: BHA will try to gain traction in our State. At first it will be little things like putting up signs for the Forest Service. Next they will be at the Legislature.
 

ndlongshot

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Next they will be at the Legislature.
Just like everyone other special interest group in this state for Ag and Energy. Wildlife interests have just as much right to be there, and I for one am glad my values are somewhat represented, although rarely heeded at the capital in Bismarck.

Do you have a problem with FB and FU and Petroleum Council and Wind too at the capital, or are they on the up and up?
 

Retired Educator

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I question the term "These trails were always illegal to drive on". None of us have always been here but from my experience that is not necessarily true. I started deer hunting in the early 60's. First license was in 1964 with a mule deer tag. When I started hunting there were virtually no rules on where you could drive. I knew of some parties that would tie a long rope to two pickups and drive through a Soil Bank, "similar to CRP that we have today." The rope would chase up animals in the grass and hunters would shoot. Not sure if it was legal back then but it certainly wasn't uncommon.

Hunting on National Grassland back then there were many trails, some of them were pretty well-groomed, through the grasslands. Not suggesting there were trails through every draw but you could drive from one area to another. Never heard of a rule against driving on these trails and never was suggested that it was illegal. Then the state put a rule in place that prevented "Driving off Trail" while hunting. Legal to drive off to retrieve but not for any other purpose. National Grasslands used the same rules as far as I knew. Not long after National Grasslands changed to no driving off trail at all. No mention of it being illegal to drive on these trails at all. No rancher or other hunter ever mentioned to me that it was illegal to drive on these trails.

To suggest that BHA was helping put up signs that had always been there doesn't seem right to me as A couple years ago there was all of a sudden a sign on a trial that didn't replace any kind of a sign at all. Other than to keep the public out of public land it serves no purpose.

An statement made earlier that hunters got into arguments about how one person arrived at a location versus another and wardens were involved causes me to question that as well. Never in my life have I heard of such a situation. It may have happened but pretty sure it's about as common as getting hit by lightning while deer hunting in November. Question it especially if it was a State Game Warden. Heard a question/answer session quite a few years ago, long enough that it was at least a State Director or two before our current Director. The question was about some new rules the USFW was establishing on National Grasslands. His response was "The state enforces state laws and rules." He would not elaborate.

As I said at the beginning, I'm not sure about all the rules and laws, just what I have seen or heard in the past 56 years of hunting of which at least 3/4 of them have been in the National Grasslands. Other than I see more hunters, I don't see a lot of difference. Truth is I prefer seeing hunters over signs that eliminate travel where travel was allowed for years. I'm not arguing for new trails wherever a person wants to drive, just allow travel that was historically allowed.
 

AaronJ

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The blowhard state chairman would keep me from every becoming a part of BHA; no matter how wonderful the national organization may be. I can only go by what was posted of his writing and what he has posted here himself; but he shines a horrible light on the organization.
 


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