The "NEW" SB 2315 - Pucker Up Buttercup!

[Boondoggle]

I posted these stats in the other No Trespass Law post regarding version 1 of SB 2315.

Here are a few key things I gathered from the fiscal note:

-$250K to build the database and mapping application.
-$892 for 6 new FTE to administer landowner agreements and database/mapping application.
-Add them up and it's $1.142M for 2019-2021 biennium
-$892K for the 2021-2023 biennium (without database construction)
-Average those numbers and it's roughly $500K/year for the first 4 years.

-The fiscal agreement estimates 3,166 posting agreements, equating to a cost of roughly $160/posting agreement.

Applying version 1 numbers above to version X that we're on now, and assuming an average 300 acres/agreement as stated in the fiscal note, then the database cost is roughly $0.53/acre ($160/300 acres). Posting one section of land into the database would cost approximately $340/section for the database term length (annually?). Where's that money going to come from? The hunter? The other 600,000 citizens of ND? The supporters of the database?

I don't own land to post but I'll estimate very conservatively that it currently costs $100/section annually with labor, equipment and paper signs. I'll also estimate it will cost $100/section of landowners time to fiddle around with an online database form. The cost of posting signs currently vs posting in an online database is a wash.

This is extremely inefficient, and the landowners would continue to have trespassers, slob hunters, animal rights activists, protesters, etc. to contend with. SB 2315 is a waste of time and money.

 

[ndlongshot]

When is the press conference and/or senate vote?

 

[Migrator Man]

Listened to the replay from this morning. As expected the reporters failed to ask the right questions that have many of us concerned.

One interesting thing I heard was that this database was opt in and that landowners are not required to participate in the app, but the lawmakers said they can still post the land traditionally if they don’t want to be on the app. How is this app going to prevent conflicts with landowners if the app shows the land as green and the land is physically posted? Eberle said we will no longer have the problem of not seeing the sign because we will be going off of the app. They are making this law even more complicated and will lead to more confusion with landowners and hunters.

This law needs to be voted down because it is bad legislation as it is currently written.

 

[guywhofishes]

New 2018 NDGF Violation report is out.

Criminal Trespass among hunters dropped in 2018. (48 for 140,000+ or .03%).

 

[Brian Renville]

New 2018 NDGF Violation report is out.

Criminal Trespass among hunters dropped in 2018. (48 for 140,000+ or .03%).

I was talking to some folks and they said they spend a good amout of time opening weekends chasing people off their land. It's posted legally. I asked how many were charged? Zero. Well no wonder people do it. Nothing about this that changes any of that.

 

[fireone]

New 2018 NDGF Violation report is out.

Criminal Trespass among hunters dropped in 2018. (48 for 140,000+ or .03%).

SB-2315 is a hot topic in the senate, soaking up their time from important legislation, for 48 trespass violations. Makes perfect sense.

 

[ndlongshot]

"Its not anti hunters or about hunting!".........butttttt, then why does Game and Fish have to foot the bill for this disaster in the making?

 

[1bigfokker]

Databases are difficult to manage especially in GIS formats and that is with training. The lawmakers need to consult the GIS professionals before this goes to far. It's not going to be as easy as they envision, but they're visionaries. This will take longer to implement than medical marijuana. You know how fucked up that turned out.

 

[MuleyMadness]

At the very least it should not pass just for the sake of no one has a damn clue how the database is going to work. If they were smart they would wait until it is up and running and do a damn power point presentation at a senate hearing. I will always be against it but at least if I knew exactly what was all changing, how it was changing and how the data base worked at least I could give them the benefit of the doubt and say O, Ok that makes sense. For right now I do not think even the guys voting yes in the senate really know. This is not an issue that you can just make it up on the fly and say o yeah we kind of did this and that wrong. Its need to be put down until it is 110% set in stone.

 

[njsimonson]

Senate just adjourned. They did not get to 2315. Most likely tomorrow.

SB 2054 was defeated - it would have removed preference for conservation efforts in Outdoor Heritage Fund Grants, and given money to non-hunting/fishing/conservation outdoor projects. So there's hope they can do the right thing!

 

[ndlongshot]

Senate just adjourned. They did not get to 2315. Most likely tomorrow.

SB 2054 was defeated - it would have removed preference for conservation efforts in Outdoor Heritage Fund Grants, and given money to non-hunting/fishing/conservation outdoor projects. So there's hope they can do the right thing!

Thanks for the update, Nick.

There is still time to email the senate and let them know where you stand! We need to to drive home the point that this is one RIDICULOUS proposal.

 

[fireone]

hcanderson@nd.gov, jbakke@nd.gov ,bbekkedahl@nd.gov ,raburckhard@nd.gov ,dclemens@nd.gov , dcook@nd.gov, kdavison@nd.gov ,ddever@nd.gov , jdotzenrod@nd.gov, madwyer@nd.gov ,jayelkin@nd.gov , rerbele@nd.gov, rfors@nd.gov , jgrabinger@nd.gov, jheckaman@nd.gov ,khogan@nd.gov , dhogue@nd.gov, rholmberg@nd.gov ,jkannianen@nd.gov ,
jklein@nd.gov, kkrebsbach@nd.gov ,ckreun@nd.gov , olarsen@nd.gov, dklarson@nd.gov, galee@nd.gov , jlee@nd.gov, lluick@nd.gov ,rmarcellais@nd.gov ,tmathern@nd.gov, scottmeyer@nd.gov ,jmyrdal@nd.gov , eoban@nd.gov, doehlke@nd.gov , aosland@nd.gov, dpatten@nd.gov ,mpiepkorn@nd.gov ,npoolman@nd.gov ,lrobinson@nd.gov ,jroers@nd.gov , kroers@nd.gov, drust@nd.gov , dgschaible@nd.gov, rsorvaag@nd.gov ,jkunruh@nd.gov , svedaa@nd.gov, tmwanzek@nd.gov , rwardner@nd.gov

There must be undecided senators yet or this bill would have shoved forward. Still time to contact them now.

 

[wslayer]

Data base, what a crock of shit. Prone to be a nightmare for all. G&F, Sheriffs, Landowners, and Hunters.

I wrote the Game & Fish 10 years ago about raising license fees for the sole purpose of purchasing metal signs for landowners, with Name on sign. Asked them specifically for some type of response whether good or bad. Never did hear anything.

Violations need to be taken seriously and punishment / fines need to be increased drastically

 

[ndlongshot]

Data base, what a crock of shit. Prone to be a nightmare for all. G&F, Sheriffs, Landowners, and Hunters.

I wrote the Game & Fish 10 years ago about raising license fees for the sole purpose of purchasing metal signs for landowners, with Name on sign. Asked them specifically for some type of response whether good or bad. Never did hear anything.

Violations need to be taken seriously and punishment / fines need to be increased drastically

And this bill decreases penalties!! Unreal! Its the opposite of what should have been done in the first place! Thats the government for you! F up a wet dream...

 

[FishSticks]

Well I emailed the entire senate voicing my disgust at SB 2315.

 

[zoops]

kfyrtv had a story about the bill tonight, I just caught the end of it (I'm sure it'll be on at 10 as well) - seemed like they were portraying it positively. Said the vote will be at 1:00 tomorrow.

 

[PrairieGhost]

I heard back from four legislators. Three against and Wanzek dost 29 for.

 

[eyexer]

I was reading some posts on facebook about this. I had to laugh when one farmer was offended by someone calling farmers a special interest group. WTF. They're the biggest special interest group in the country. And they can't even see it.

 

[dank]

Is the actual language that will be voted on been posted in any official capacity?

 

[Migrator Man]

I was reading some posts on facebook about this. I had to laugh when one farmer was offended by someone calling farmers a special interest group. WTF. They're the biggest special interest group in the country. And they can't even see it.

And what’s even better is that they think they have no reason to keep sportsmen happy. You alienate that group and you will lose one of the biggest supporters of their tax breaks, programs and exemptions that the rest of us non landowners and non farm business people don’t receive. Rural communities are getting smaller and smaller with less and less support for rural issues. Why do they get everything they want, but the rest of us just need to step aside and be ok with it? They are given a government backed guaranteed business for God’s sake.

- - - Updated - - -

kfyrtv had a story about the bill tonight, I just caught the end of it (I'm sure it'll be on at 10 as well) - seemed like they were portraying it positively. Said the vote will be at 1:00 tomorrow.

Well there was no one there that knew what questions needed to be asked. So much for the media keeping these legislators honest.