Vanguard 257 Weatherby Magnum

[luvcatchingbass]

I have always been interested in a 257 Weatherby Magnum but since I bought a 6.5-284 in 2012 I kind of shelved the intrest in buying one, plus I couldn't find one in the price range I wanted. This weekend I came across a pre-owned Vanguard 26-28in fluted barrel, cerakot that I am guessing is around 3yrs old and either barely shot or never shot looking at the wear on the bolt and lack of discoloration on the muzzle break. They are asking $650, what are your guys thoughts on this for price? I'm not crazy about the stock so that would probably be on the chopping block beings it has a freely flexible fore end.
Any feedback from those that have them or used them would be appreciated, what game species, what bullet choices, ranges you have used them, anything else you can think of.
Thanks

 

[SDMF]

Vanguard is generally a very accurate rifle, it’s the same as the Howa 1500.

You’ve already mentioned the stock. I’d swap out the trigger too. Other than those 2 things, it should be ready to go.

They use the same scope bases as a 700 so there’s about a billion good choices to suit your fancy.

I got my 257Wby in 2008. I’ve primarily shot 100gn TSX out of it. 1 Black bear, 1 cow elk, a pile of whitetails and a couple Mule Deer. I’ve more recently worked up a load for 95Gn Badlands Super BullDozer but I haven’t shot any animals with that bullet yet.

 

[svnmag]

I have my own prejudices and concerns:

Is it stamped "California", "Japan" or "worse"?

Weatherby ammo is only designed for "speed" and "power". Factory ammo (Weatherby specific) has become a "curiosity" and "collectable" like baseball cards, KISS or Star Trek. IMHO

In Africa .460 rifles are known to "bust": Not a fan.

 

[SDMF]

I have my own prejudices and concerns:

Is it stamped "California", "Japan" or "worse"?

Weatherby ammo is only designed for "speed" and "power". Factory ammo (Weatherby specific) has become a "curiosity" and "collectable" like baseball cards, KISS or Star Trek. IMHO

In Africa .460 rifles are known to "bust": Not a fan.

Vanguard will be Japanese 2-lug. Very similar to a 700 w/an M-16 style extractor and an integral recoil lug rather that pinning or sandwiching one.

 

[svnmag]

Vanguard will be Japanese 2-lug. Very similar to a 700 w/an M-16 style extractor and an integral recoil lug rather that pinning or sandwiching one.

That's the "prejudice".

 

[luvcatchingbass]

Vanguard is generally a very accurate rifle, it’s the same as the Howa 1500.

You’ve already mentioned the stock. I’d swap out the trigger too. Other than those 2 things, it should be ready to go.

They use the same scope bases as a 700 so there’s about a billion good choices to suit your fancy.

I got my 257Wby in 2008. I’ve primarily shot 100gn TSX out of it. 1 Black bear, 1 cow elk, a pile of whitetails and a couple Mule Deer. I’ve more recently worked up a load for 95Gn Badlands Super BullDozer but I haven’t shot any animals with that bullet yet.

One thing I forgot to mention is that it looks like there was never a scope mounted to it as there is no base on it and the tapped holes didn't have any signs of being used.
Forgot about the trigger, I had read a few forums with that mentioned, what would you recommend a Timney? What would be some of your stock options I should look at. I do like the idea of a slightly more vertical grip, kind of in between a swept back sporter and target vertical. I kind of figured at $650 it gives me room to play.
I was thinking on reloading options and 90-100gr TSX/TTSX (done these in the past on 7mm Rem Mag) or CX (have not played with these yet) and or something like 110gr ELDX or Berger. I just looked up the Badlands bullets, thanks now I got more tinkering/experimenting idea in my head, I'm trying to settle on what to setup for my 7mm Rem Mag for my Aoudad hunt.

 

[luvcatchingbass]

I take it $650 is a pretty fair price for a gun that probably has not been shot or shot very little.

 

[SDMF]

I'm a big fan of mono-metal projectiles @ 257Wby type speeds on big-game. I don't like "splashy" projectiles for big game, especially not @ 257 Wby velocity. Pretty much everything with a lead core is "splashy" @ 257Wby velocity.

There's newer projectiles available than when I initially worked things up for my 257Wby, but, when I was looking, I couldn't find a ballistic advantage over 100gn. The velocity loss due to extra weight wasn't enough BC/ballistic gain to give up the velocity advantage of 100's. It's been 15yrs, there's certainly stuff that I haven't considered. Give or take, you're going to be limited to 120gn projectiles @ the top end due to the factory 1:10 twist.

Regarding stocks in no particular order:

Manners, McMillan, Stocky's, AG Composites, OutKast Arms, Bell and Carlson.

OutKast is the guys who used to work for Melvin Forbes @ NULA I believe are $750 for a re-stock, but, that includes a full-length bedding job from a bunch of folks who are really good at it.

Regarding triggers, the only aftermarket I've ever used that I didn't like was Rifle Basix. Timmy seems to probably be the easiest solution from an availability standpoint and they make a trigger that's easy to get into the 2.5-3# range safely. You might be able to adjust them lower, but, that's where I stop for my own uses.

 

[luvcatchingbass]

I'm a big fan of mono-metal projectiles @ 257Wby type speeds on big-game. I don't like "splashy" projectiles for big game, especially not @ 257 Wby velocity. Pretty much everything with a lead core is "splashy" @ 257Wby velocity.

There's newer projectiles available than when I initially worked things up for my 257Wby, but, when I was looking, I couldn't find a ballistic advantage over 100gn. The velocity loss due to extra weight wasn't enough BC/ballistic gain to give up the velocity advantage of 100's. It's been 15yrs, there's certainly stuff that I haven't considered. Give or take, you're going to be limited to 120gn projectiles @ the top end due to the factory 1:10 twist.

Regarding stocks in no particular order:

Manners, McMillan, Stocky's, AG Composites, OutKast Arms, Bell and Carlson.

OutKast is the guys who used to work for Melvin Forbes @ NULA I believe are $750 for a re-stock, but, that includes a full-length bedding job from a bunch of folks who are really good at it.

Regarding triggers, the only aftermarket I've ever used that I didn't like was Rifle Basix. Timmy seems to probably be the easiest solution from an availability standpoint and they make a trigger that's easy to get into the 2.5-3# range safely. You might be able to adjust them lower, but, that's where I stop for my own uses.

I picked up that gun last night, for the price of $650 and after I looked at it again I just couldn't say no with a brand new one being $1,150. You could see it did have a scope rail on it at one time but looking at the bold and the muzzle brake there was so little wear it either was cleaned really really good or not shot much. Just to get me shooting sooner to start playing with it I had them put a 1pc Leupold rail on, set of Warren rings and grabbed a Cheap Vortex Crossfire II 4-12x44 (this scope will be getting moved to one of my other guns I just tinker with eventually).
Looked at stock options last night Stocky's might be the front runner right now, would you swap it out yourself or recommend having someone experienced do it and do a bedding job?
Need to track down a good set of reloading dies and some brass. I grabbed 2 boxes of factory ammo just to start playing around.
Think I might order up some of those Badlands Bulldozer II bullets after reading up on them a little.

 

[SDMF]

.425BC @ 3600+ w/manageable recoil is a pretty darned good hunting package.

I settled in on Ramshot Magnum powder back in '08 and haven't tried anything else since. Stuff meters slicker than snot through a Culver style powder measure and gives excellent ES/SD, velocity, and accuracy.

257 Dies Midway

257 Dies, Precision Reloading

Couple options there depending on what else each has in stock you might also want/need to order.

 

[luvcatchingbass]

.425BC @ 3600+ w/manageable recoil is a pretty darned good hunting package.

I settled in on Ramshot Magnum powder back in '08 and haven't tried anything else since. Stuff meters slicker than snot through a Culver style powder measure and gives excellent ES/SD, velocity, and accuracy.

257 Dies Midway

257 Dies, Precision Reloading

Couple options there depending on what else each has in stock you might also want/need to order.

Never tried Forster dies, judging by the price they must be a step above the Redding and RCBS I am used to. In the past I have always full length sized everything, lately my buddy has been doing more neck sizing with occasional full length sizing. What are your thoughts on that for a practice? I really haven't been nerding out on reloading for a few years and am just starting to get back into it again
With my 7mm Rem Mag I got some H1000 I was going to start playing with and at a quick look in my books see it can cross into the 257, Ramshot Magnum has piqued my interest before

 

[SDMF]

H1000 should work, especially if you already have it, as right now Magnum seems to be out of stock.

I did neck-size only, then just partial neck sizing for a while. I'm back to the simplicity and simply easy feeding of a slight shoulder bump.

I like the very small and mobile expander ball of the Forster dies as well as the sleeved seater that helps get the projectile lined up w/the neck prior to seating.

 

[1lessdog]

I picked up that gun last night, for the price of $650 and after I looked at it again I just couldn't say no with a brand new one being $1,150. You could see it did have a scope rail on it at one time but looking at the bold and the muzzle brake there was so little wear it either was cleaned really really good or not shot much. Just to get me shooting sooner to start playing with it I had them put a 1pc Leupold rail on, set of Warren rings and grabbed a Cheap Vortex Crossfire II 4-12x44 (this scope will be getting moved to one of my other guns I just tinker with eventually).
Looked at stock options last night Stocky's might be the front runner right now, would you swap it out yourself or recommend having someone experienced do it and do a bedding job?
Need to track down a good set of reloading dies and some brass. I grabbed 2 boxes of factory ammo just to start playing around.
Think I might order up some of those Badlands Bulldozer II bullets after reading up on them a little.

I wouldn't restock it right away. I would see how it shoots with the original stock.

I have two of the Vanguard in 257 Wby Mag and they shoot pretty good. The factory triggers are something else. When you get them down to 2.5 lbs the safety may not work

 

[Longtine]

I will add this....the 257 does not bounce off deer.............just sayin

 

[luvcatchingbass]

I wouldn't restock it right away. I would see how it shoots with the original stock.

I have two of the Vanguard in 257 Wby Mag and they shoot pretty good. The factory triggers are something else. When you get them down to 2.5 lbs the safety may not work

With the expected lead times some stocks have I'm not waiting, I'm not a fan of flimsy stocks that push on barrels.

 

[Tymurrey]

The 100gr tsx shoots great pushed by a hefty dose of reloader 25 in my rifle. I'm going to have to switch to H1000 i think for my next batch due to availability issues of alliant powder. I'm not pushing them crazy hard because accuracy dropped off some at max load. I'm at around 3450 fps and can verify they expand and kill out past 500 yards on deer an antelope. I picked up some of the LRX bullets when components were hard to come by and will see how they shoot at some point hopefully.

 

[1lessdog]

With the expected lead times some stocks have I'm not waiting, I'm not a fan of flimsy stocks that push on barrels.

The pushing on the barrel is a ten min fix. A little sandpaper and wood dowel.

 

[SupressYourself]

The pushing on the barrel is a ten min fix. A little sandpaper and wood dowel.

Or a deep socket of the appropriate size. Wrap in sandpaper and hog the barrel channel out a bit.
Also, bedding an action is not a difficult task. Plenty on the U tubes about it.

I would scrape the barrel channel a bit, then shoot it some. If you're getting fliers, then try bedding. I wouldn't spend the money on a new stock unless there's some specific upgrade you're after, like an adjustable cheek piece, or converting to detachable mag, etc.

 

[luvcatchingbass]

Well one thing I guess I didn't mention is getting a better LOP of my 12yr old daughter and I'm starting to like a little more forward grip angle if I can get it doesn't have to be vertical. I like the shim system that Grayboe Stocks has, especially for me because I seem to always have to put a neoprene sleeve with different thickness spacers in for myself which isn't the end of the world. I've modified a couple factory stocks and what I have in the end is still a flexible fore end.

 

[1lessdog]

Well one thing I guess I didn't mention is getting a better LOP of my 12yr old daughter and I'm starting to like a little more forward grip angle if I can get it doesn't have to be vertical. I like the shim system that Grayboe Stocks has, especially for me because I seem to always have to put a neoprene sleeve with different thickness spacers in for myself which isn't the end of the world. I've modified a couple factory stocks and what I have in the end is still a flexible fore end.

Starting a 12 yr old girl on a 257 Wby would not be my first choice. It's going to rock the hell out of her.