Tree planting ?'s

[yellowsign]

Has anyone on here went directly into CRP/Sod ground with a tree planter and had good success rates?
Looking at getting some more tree rows going but would like to stay away from laying plastic as I currently have 6000 to plant. Last year planted around 1200 and Im guessing 60% survival (planted with shovel). Species of trees are norway and colorado spruce and hybrid poplars and willows.

 

[KDM]

Yes!! I've planted hundreds of soil conservation sized trees in CRP or grassland type ground. GREAT BIG HUMONGOUS F'N FAILURE!!!! Did you get that?? The grass will choke out every single tree you plant and the ones that survive will be taken out by pocket gophers. I've planted willow, oak, ash, dogwood, and rose trees/plants with ZERO success when no weed barrier is applied. Keeping the grass off your young saplings is imperitive if you want them to survive. Not only does the grass suck the nutrients and water from the young tree, but it shades it out as well. I've given up planting conservation sized trees and buy trees that are 8 ft tall or taller. I can protect these with hog fence and the grass is SOL when trying to shade or choke them out. Yes, they take more money to buy and protect, but I've had 90+ percent survival rate of the couple hundred I've planted. I'd be more than happy to discuss my mostly failures with habitat establishement along with the relatively few successes/ PM me if you're interested.

 

[Srputz]

I have also planted into sod, but my success has been pretty good. Black hills spruce eastern red ceder, Colorado spruce, and ponderosa pine. The biggest problem is bucks rubbing on them. They will snap them off and then move to the next. Soil conservation did it and I'm doing some more this year. I have better luck that way. Hand planting into grass does not work as Kdm has mentioned.

 

[Ponyroper]

Yes!! I've planted hundreds of soil conservation sized trees in CRP or grassland type ground. GREAT BIG HUMONGOUS F'N FAILURE!!!! Did you get that?? The grass will choke out every single tree you plant and the ones that survive will be taken out by pocket gophers. I've planted willow, oak, ash, dogwood, and rose trees/plants with ZERO success when no weed barrier is applied. Keeping the grass off your young saplings is imperitive if you want them to survive. Not only does the grass suck the nutrients and water from the young tree, but it shades it out as well. I've given up planting conservation sized trees and buy trees that are 8 ft tall or taller. I can protect these with hog fence and the grass is SOL when trying to shade or choke them out. Yes, they take more money to buy and protect, but I've had 90+ percent survival rate of the couple hundred I've planted. I'd be more than happy to discuss my mostly failures with habitat establishement along with the relatively few successes/ PM me if you're interested.

I agree. I work planting trees for the Morton Co. Soil Conservation District and even when the grass is killed with Roundup ahead of time the results are usually not pretty. Work the ground up good ahead of time and put down a weed barrier and you will have decent survival most years. Also, pick the right trees for you soil type.

 

[yellowsign]

My thoughts were to mow then spray the lines/areas where the trees are planted and see what happens. im not to worried about the poplars or the willows as they grow so rapidly but would like to get the spruces rooted that first year especially and see how they do. trying a root innoculate this year as well if it does half as good on trees as corn ill be happy. have access to plenty of wood chips for a barrier but to cover that many trees would take an army and i only know so many people who work for busch lights. will pm you KDM thanks for the advice

 

[bowhunter12]

http://habitat-talk.com/index.php?forums/native-habitat.3/

Lots of info here for planting and habitat improvement.

 

[Tymurrey]

I've planted close to 2,000 in native prairie over about the last 5 years. Most have been cedar and juniper. I didn't have a very good plan just kind of walking an planting as I went so I never did any site prep, just step in the dibble bar, stick in a tree and keep moving. I also didn't graze the pasture trying to let the trees establish their roots and I honestly feel that hurt some of the survival by not keeping the grass down. I am pretty sure that most of my deciduous trees failed, whether that be from competition or browsed by deer. If I had to guess I'm only getting about 30% survival rate on the juniper and cedars this way but a lot of that was from lack of experience planting. I didn't do my research very well and didn't realize how fast roots dry out and "j root" and even the year I planted a couple hundred with an auger, I didn't realize how the settlement was bad for them. I've had a lot better success with just the dibble bar. This year I will be planting less and tubing all of my trees to prevent browse damage and allowing me to spray around them and then work in a pre emergent herbicide.

 

[Wildyote]

The only 2 options if you want your trees to grow is to use fabric or till between rows and use weed badger within rows. If you are planting more than 6000 ft why don't you use Outdoor Heritage fund. I wish it was around when I planted all my rows. Pheasants forever also cost shares trees on top of the state program. This will keep costs down to an affordable price. You will need to talk to your local soil conservation office. You will be too late for the Outdoor Heritage Program this year unless you have trees ordered already.

 

[yellowsign]

Wouldnt there have to be public access through the heritage fund? Also if i would end up putting down fabric where is the best place to get it? Soil conservation is at $150/ 500 ft

 

[Fritz the Cat]

Planted several miles of trees using a bunch of tillage. Keep the dirt loose. Cultivate before weeds get ahead and suck everything out the soil. Used a weed badger between the trees which worked great because the dirt was loose between rows.

Today, most programs won't get involved if you don't use weed fabric/barrier. Burned too many times by fellows with good intentions and then let the weeds get ahead. Just a guess. I'm not a fan of weed barrier because a person cannot do a decent job of cultivating between rows.

They want weed barrier. Weeds will sprout out of the same hole in the fabric as the tree. DO NOT pull these weeds around the tree during dry periods/conditions. By loosening the soil, it will dry out and your tree will die.

Cultivate the shit out of the ground the year before. If creeping jenny shows up you will want to get that under control first. Haste makes waste. Get in a hurry and that weed will make you cuss for several years.

There are shortcuts such as Princep herbicide. Does it throttle the tree seedlings some? Can't say for sure.

 

[BrokenBackJack]

Rather than using a shovel to plant, get a bobcat with a set of forks on it. Take one fork off and put the other one in the middle of the machine. Mark up from the tip of the fork 12''-14'' and mark it with duct tape. You then mark out a straight line and just use the bobcat to make the holes. Works good to soak the hole with water, let it set, put your tree in the so the root goes down and then fill with dirt. Works slick and with 3-4 people you can really plant the trees. You can go back and resoak the trees after being all planted and tapped too.
We planted thousands this way and had very good success but very few were in prairie grass.
Too often when planted by a tree planting machine the roots are horizontal and not vertical. Makes a big difference.

 

[Wildyote]

Wouldnt there have to be public access through the heritage fund? Also if i would end up putting down fabric where is the best place to get it? Soil conservation is at $150/ 500 ft

I don't think you need to provide public access but I would check first. The soil conservation would be the place to get fabric but Brock White carries it too I think.

 

[sierra1995]

KDM,

What about in a mowed yard? i've got 500 trees coming in late april, all conservation size. Freeman Maple, Meyer Spruce and Lilacs. I was planning on drilling holes with the dirt auger, then planting. I keep everything mowed and plan on watering weekly. Thoughts?

 

[Yoby]

Over the last 5 years I probably have planted 1000 trees. First trees were arborvitaes. Used my tiller to loosen the ground went back through with hand shovel. planted 75 in that line and placed 2ft x 2ft fabric around them. I still have to replace another 14 this year do to die back. Planted about 200 evergreens in prairie. Did the same thing. tilled, shoveled, but this time I spread them out enough to get a brush hog/lawn mower in there. Only thing I do is mow around them. These have turned out awesome. Another 200 trees this way has yielded the same results. I the picked up a 12in auger for my tractor. Have planted quite a few with just a quite shovel to remove sod and then auger to loosen the soil. This has had mixed results. One thing that I have found is that leaving some weeds around the trees creates a catch. It catches more snow & rain and around the base of the tree stays more moist.

Several other I have just driven along with the tractor/auger and popped holes. depending on the tree type it work very well or horrible. All my junipers have made it this way, but no deciduous trees did.

I am in the protection mode this year. Alot of my trees are hitting the 3-4 ft tall and the buck starting beat the crap out of them last fall. Picking up a lot of fence posts and going to be pound posts on 3 or 4 sides to keep the bucks at bay.

 

[Ponyroper]

I don't think you need to provide public access but I would check first. The soil conservation would be the place to get fabric but Brock White carries it too I think.

My neighbor to the west bought some cheap ass tree fabric from a box store last spring and all summer long the wind shredded it and the shreds were blowing into my yard. If you buy fabric get the good stuff from soil conservation.

 

[Lycanthrope]

Im wondering if a strong garlic spray applied pre-rut might help keep bucks at bay. I think Id roundup, till, add some compost and water frequently to give them a competitive advantage during that critical first year. If you can afford it, grow tubes are great but they will cost an extra $1-$2 dollars / tree, which may be impractical for large plantings...

 

[Bacon]

If you get lots of rain first year, almost anything works. The best for trees as was mentioned is black dirt and keep them clean. We have planted miles and miles of trees. The best was when we cultivated and hand hoed. Doesn't that sound like fun? Cultivating and using weed badger is what I will do this year. Gonna put some more trees in. Still have nightmares of my grandma getting me up at 5:30 am to hoe trees.

 

[Big Iron]

Thank you for planting trees.

 

[KDM]

KDM,

What about in a mowed yard? i've got 500 trees coming in late april, all conservation size. Freeman Maple, Meyer Spruce and Lilacs. I was planning on drilling holes with the dirt auger, then planting. I keep everything mowed and plan on watering weekly. Thoughts?

Biggest deal with a mowed yard will be deer, rabbits, and mice IMO. I've had to wrap each tree with hog fence in my yard to keep the deer from eating, rubbing, and generally trashing the trees. Soil type in your yard will be an issue as will soil nutrients as grass takes most of the nutrients out of the top 6 or so inches of soil. I put various types of manure in with the soils I took out of the holes I dug for the trees. It seemed to help. If you leave a small depression around the tree it will make watering and triming around the bases of the tree easier. Watch for aphids, tent worms, and other insects that prefer small succulent leaves and shoots found on young trees. It's kind of a labor of love as IMO, you need to keep an almost daily tab on your trees for the first couple years to make sure they get good root development. Hope this helps and good luck!!!

 

[Fritz the Cat]

Bacon,

do you currently own a weed badger?