Public meeting in Garrison: Pipilines under Sak proposed

[onpoint!]

So is anyone on here a member of "Friends of Sakakawea" or another group who's planning on attending? I'm going to try to be there, it all sounds like a bad idea to me but I'm one voice. Maybe the NDA's powerful lobbying force should make its mark...

 

[Davy Crockett]

Onpoint , If I was closer I would strongly consider attending, I think double wall pipeline is worth mentioning. Those that work in the industry sometimes feel topics/issues like this cripple the industry. Money is nothing to big oil no matter how hard they try to cover up that fact, If a new 2500 mile pipeline will cash flow then this little project is pocket change.

#Guywholikestobeonthecuttingedge I can't find the episode I watched, I don't remember exactly where I saw it. but I found an animation of the machine. They named it UT-1



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I can't even imagine the size of HDD drill it would take to do the job, No matter how good the contractor is , You are only as good as what the ground gives you.

I watched them build railroad tracks and run boring machines off a rail system and that was a small project compared to this.
Conflicting stories, One said 100' below the river bed and one said 100' below the lake bottom.

http://bismarcktribune.com/bakken/s...cle_5af4870e-6d10-553b-95c5-ec261f1ef446.html

 

[guywhofishes]

 

[onpoint!]

Thanks for the ideas. Will throw them at the wall to wall to see what sticks.

 

[FightingSioux]

The problem I see is with a man made lake is they would pretty much build bed of rocks that will fall in the trench. Not sure how much that really matters with steel but I'm pretty sure having a rock free bedding is in all the specs. If not it should be. Almost all leaks start from the inside from corrosion, That makes a guy wonder what condition those 30 year old lines are in and who is monitoring them. Seems to me it was Charlson ND, West of Newtown, where we could never find the corrosion rings that we put in the drill stem to measure corrosion, it was that bad.

False mr Crockett , most oil pipeline failures are from third party damage and external corrosion. Internal corrosion is a very rare failure in pipelines.

You need to worry about the old pipelines and not the new ones. The new ones if properly installed via HDD are almost guaranteed to never have a leak from third party damage or external corrosion. Heck some of the existing pipelines have been there for 50 years with no issues. Proper cathodic protection is the solution.

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there have been many pipelines HDD drilled for over a mile. They can be tested to see what the condition of the coating is after the pull through. Water slot trenching is very outdated and should not be used because the pipe is not buried deep enough. If it makes you guys feel any better I would bet a million dollars that the corps of engineers will make them HDD it. They should also have a CP system installed on both sides of the river to prevent any external corrosion.

 

[eyexer]

there are thousands of miles of pipeline under the floor of the gulf of mexico. most have been water trenched in.

 

[Migrator Man]

I don't think trenching is the best for River crossings. Look at the Yellowstone leaks where the river washed away over 10' of dirt over the life of the lines. Double wall pipe would also not be good because the inner pipe could not be protected from corrosion.

 

[Davy Crockett]

]False mr Crockett , most oil pipeline failures are from third party damage and external corrosion. Internal corrosion is a very rare failure in pipelines. [/I]

You need to worry about the old pipelines and not the new ones. The new ones if properly installed via HDD are almost guaranteed to never have a leak from third party damage or external corrosion. Heck some of the existing pipelines have been there for 50 years with no issues. Proper cathodic protection is the solution.

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there have been many pipelines HDD drilled for over a mile. They can be tested to see what the condition of the coating is after the pull through. Water slot trenching is very outdated and should not be used because the pipe is not buried deep enough. If it makes you guys feel any better I would bet a million dollars that the corps of engineers will make them HDD it. They should also have a CP system installed on both sides of the river to prevent any external corrosion.

I stand corrected Fighting Sioux, I am surprised external corrosion is a bigger issue than internal corrosion. One question I always wondered is When they weld steel pipelines do they coat the inside of the pipe at the joints after the welds cool ?
I spent most of my time around the rigs without corrosion inhibitors and chemicals, it's unreal how fast uncoated steel can get eaten up by corrosion and still looks like new on the outside if it's in open air.

 

[Migrator Man]

Gas pipelines have issues with internal corrosion as I remember a few explosions in MN. Production lines and piping scares the heck out of me with all the acids and salt water in those lines. I don't think pipelines coat the inside of the pipe?

 

[eyexer]

they send corrosion inhibitors down the pipeline with the oil. There are also corrosion inhibitors sent down the well to prevent corrosion of the casing, tubing, etc. This also ends up in the oil and down the pipelines. They also use anodes to prevent corrosion.