No problem kurt, I see your point. I wear carhartts when its really cold in the badlands. Most years i just layer underneath jeans. Just my opinion and what works well for me without breaking the bank. Appreciate the ability to disagree in a tactful manner. Im sure many farmers and ranchers could care less what camo a guy wears but with commodity prices low im sure those that do know what kuiu or sitka is really appreciate how well everyone else seems to have it when pulling in to ask to hunt..... just sayin, just my opinion, not looking for an argument or being insulted.....