Abortion?

[Traxion]

generally speaking, i am against abortion. however, i disagree that an "embryo" is necessarily a "life" deserving of legal protection. think embryonic in the terms of infertility treatments or possibly embryonic selection for a couple that are genetic dynamite. you take sperm and you fertilize an egg... often times outside the uterus. you culture that fertilized egg in a dish. at 3 days, a well graded embryo is only 8 cells. then you freeze em. often times freeze many of them. to be used in IVF. folks use IVF for a variety of reasons. are those frozen globs of cells in a dish in a freezer worthy of the same protections as a fetus with a heart beat? my opinion? no. some scoff at "playing god" in this way. but, i am not so sure god would judge two loving parents who desperately want a baby and are going to do their best to give him/her a great life in this shit hole of a world vary harshly.

i am also "ok" with it in certain extreme circumstances. here is one example on the extreme end of things and it was on TV last night. mom is carrying a baby. first ultrasound. call it 12 weeks? reveals little to no brain matter, hole in the skull and a massive hole in the heart. this fetus has zero chance of survival outside the womb. likely not making it to term. if so, likely still born. but, to make it worse, the exposed brain matter is making her amnio fluid septic and her life is in a lot of danger. this one doesn't require a lot of thought for me. i would never be able to look mom in the eyes and tell her... "god's will. good luck with this one."

where do you draw the line on what is "extreme" circumstances? how do you define mom's life being "in danger"? so, many areas on this that aren't black and white for me. so, its hard for me to draw a black and white line and this gets a bit philosophical. i definitely have a line in the sand though as do many. so, no need to get into that. not productive.

Ironic or not, I just signed my second round of IVF paperwork yesterday. The topic hits home as we face the question of what will be the fate of our embryos if we don’t use them. It’s unlikely given our circumstances that we will have many, but if faced with the decision of not using them, are we committing abortion? In reading these comments, we’re just as guilty as someone who has a 20+ week abortion. As noted above, there is far more complication with this than some make it out to be. I don’t support abortion. We’ve gone through hell to get to this point and have worked every angle we could to try to have a child. I guess I can’t walk the fence in this one….if it comes down to it and we have extra embryos we choose to not use, am I going to be a criminal abortionist in SD? Depending on the law I might be. I don’t know how we could do anything differently. If you call me an abortionist, I challenge you to walk a mile in these shoes before you judge. It just simply isn’t black and white.

 

[3Roosters]

Abortion will still be legal in many states...mostly leftist states, where most of the protesting is taking place ironically. If i were a leftist marketer... i would think i would market the pro-choice persons to move to their state, kinda like Desantis marketed inviting people to move to his state during the pandemic mandate era. Try "Move here..its legal" It's a lot better marketing strategy than "burn it down".;:;rant

 

[lunkerslayer]

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[espringers]

[MENTION=983]Traxion[/MENTION] it's what prevented us from doing IvF cause we are genetic dynamite. We found out after child #2. My wife would have no part in disposing of embryos. I was a bit undecided. We ended up getting lucky (75% chance) on kid number 3 that was technically an oops. I finally got fixed. So, it's not an issue anymore. But, again... not exactly black and white. For me anyway.

 

[lunkerslayer]

Liberal the only ones who are to blame for the over turning of a 50 year old federally protected law is you and you alone. People like me have always hated the idea of pro choice by I was always sympathetic to the reality that it was considered at one time as a safe legal and rare but now an abortion is up to the moment of birth situation. Liberals were granted to use my tax dollars with that inch of respect to grabbing a mile of murder. And yes there were states that were allowing abortions up to week of giving birth. I hope our state even goes further to those woman who decide to go to Minnesota or Canada are arrested and charged with some crime that will be with them for the rest of thier lives. You did this liberals and those middle ground fence riders who lean so far to the left you could fall off, now you will have to move to the states that will allow abortions. No more taxes for you

 

[1bigfokker]

The only planning in planned Parenthood is how much money will I get. Go after the dead beat Father's money, and make them pay cash or mandatory sterilization. Limit the unwed mothers to one child.

 

[lunkerslayer]

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[svnmag]

I'd supported abortion for all these freaks in pussy hats.

 

[Obi-Wan]

Pro-choice here. Fictionally speaking I can’t let one of my relatives get raped/molested to have them deal with an unwanted pregnancy they’re not ready for. If someone rapes someone and is in prison for a decade or so. Their crime is “paid” for, and then they get out. The victim on the other hand is automatically at full responsible and is stuck with a life they didn’t want in the first place. Sure there’s adoption, but I don’t see adoption lines flooded with good parents deserving of a child, let alone wanting one to adopt from these situations.

Look into ND law on abortion that is set to begin in 30 days. I believe this is Factual

Abortion in North Dakota is expected to be legal for 30 days following the United States' Supreme Court ruling to overturn Roe v. Wade on June 24, 2022. Following the 30 days, North Dakota will likely ban "almost all abortions except in the case of rape, incest or the where mother's life is at risk."

 

[JayKay]

The fallout after this current SCOTUS ruling is raging. Both sides pointing fingers.

A couple of obvious talking points, I find interesting:

A) Suddenly, the left has no trouble defining "woman" and we're all supposed to fall in line behind them once again. The word "woman" has been twisted to "Birthing Person", or any other thing convenient. But now that women stand to lose a right, they are easily definable again.

B) Some of my friends, who are women and are Pro-Choice, suddenly feel that men should not have a vote in what happens. They claim that all these people, who are NOT WOMEN, should not get to vote. I thought for the past couple hundred years, they were screaming for equality. That there is no difference between men and women. Now they'd like to see men excluded from this topic/vote. If that's the case, then I think if a male is accused of something, there should be no women on the jury. Plain and simple.

C) One of my female friends told me this weekend, that my stance is despicable. That since I have three daughters, I should automatically be for their rights. She said "your daughters may never need or want an abortion, but you're wrecking their lives by making this illegal". I tend to take a longer view than these women, I guess. I care so much about my daughters, (and I DO believe in God) that allowing them to make a mistake is (in my opinion) allowing them to murder. When someone seeks an abortion due to convenience, or inconvenience, they're making a decision based upon only their life, and based upon only the next 20 years. I'm taking a longer view I guess. I'd rather have my daughters face a tougher life, and still end up on the right side of God.

As always, this is just my two cents (JMTC)

Jaykay

 

[Sluggo]

Looks like those worried about rape an incest can come over to the pro-life side now. And I’m no lawyer but that statement about “probability of live birth” might be an IVF exception.

 

[Tommyboy]

Ironic or not, I just signed my second round of IVF paperwork yesterday. The topic hits home as we face the question of what will be the fate of our embryos if we don’t use them. It’s unlikely given our circumstances that we will have many, but if faced with the decision of not using them, are we committing abortion? In reading these comments, we’re just as guilty as someone who has a 20+ week abortion. As noted above, there is far more complication with this than some make it out to be. I don’t support abortion. We’ve gone through hell to get to this point and have worked every angle we could to try to have a child. I guess I can’t walk the fence in this one….if it comes down to it and we have extra embryos we choose to not use, am I going to be a criminal abortionist in SD? Depending on the law I might be. I don’t know how we could do anything differently. If you call me an abortionist, I challenge you to walk a mile in these shoes before you judge. It just simply isn’t black and white.

Good luck to you and your wife. IVF was a very long and bumpy road for my wife and I. Spent alot of money and still ended up empty handed or empty womb if you will. It just about tore us apart but we are stronger now than ever. Let me know if you have any questions. What you do with the embryos after all this is over is not what you should be worried about right now. Stay positive!

 

[WormWiggler]

I wonder if sterilization after an abortion, for both male and female would have an effect.

 

[Rowdie]

Birth control is so easy nowadays there should be no unwanted pregnancies!! Abortion should be such a rare event that it's a non-issue.

 

[Davey Crockett]

What ever happened to education ? It seems like sex is one of those things you don't talk about with your kids until it's too late.

 

[guywhofishes]

The fallout after this current SCOTUS ruling is raging. Both sides pointing fingers.

A couple of obvious talking points, I find interesting:

A) Suddenly, the left has no trouble defining "woman" and we're all supposed to fall in line behind them once again. The word "woman" has been twisted to "Birthing Person", or any other thing convenient. But now that women stand to lose a right, they are easily definable again.

B) Some of my friends, who are women and are Pro-Choice, suddenly feel that men should not have a vote in what happens. They claim that all these people, who are NOT WOMEN, should not get to vote. I thought for the past couple hundred years, they were screaming for equality. That there is no difference between men and women. Now they'd like to see men excluded from this topic/vote. If that's the case, then I think if a male is accused of something, there should be no women on the jury. Plain and simple.

C) One of my female friends told me this weekend, that my stance is despicable. That since I have three daughters, I should automatically be for their rights. She said "your daughters may never need or want an abortion, but you're wrecking their lives by making this illegal". I tend to take a longer view than these women, I guess. I care so much about my daughters, (and I DO believe in God) that allowing them to make a mistake is (in my opinion) allowing them to murder. When someone seeks an abortion due to convenience, or inconvenience, they're making a decision based upon only their life, and based upon only the next 20 years. I'm taking a longer view I guess. I'd rather have my daughters face a tougher life, and still end up on the right side of God.

As always, this is just my two cents (JMTC)

Jaykay

you are a MONSTER!!!

 

[leier12]

Here is my 2 cents. Abortion is NOT birth control. Your actions have consequences, and sometimes those consequences turn into blessings and were God's plan all along. Ending a life because it becomes a burden upon you is not fair to the life being ended.

Now, in the <1% of cases classified as Rape/incest/life of the mother, I can understand the reasoning behind an abortion and that is where this discussion should start and end.

 

[lunkerslayer]

https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2022/06/what_emdobbsem_actually_says.html
Very good read on the supreme courts decision to bring the right to an abortion to the state level.

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So true

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I titty sprinkling love memes

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This is the reason why liberals have lost the fight normalizing late term abortions

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Hundreds of Amazon employees signed an open letter to Amazon leadership demanding they cease doing business in states where abortion is illegal and requesting time off to grieve the Supreme Court ruling

 

[Traxion]

Good luck to you and your wife. IVF was a very long and bumpy road for my wife and I. Spent alot of money and still ended up empty handed or empty womb if you will. It just about tore us apart but we are stronger now than ever. Let me know if you have any questions. What you do with the embryos after all this is over is not what you should be worried about right now. Stay positive!

Thanks. This is the second time thru, we were blessed with a beautiful daughter the first time. Like you said it is a tough process that strains many things. I just don’t want it to be another item in the process for people to stress over. Don’t get me wrong it’s still a huge thing, but there is so much to it I could go on for days. I am sorry it didn’t work out for you….it’s so hard to take when it’s so easy for most everyone else.

 

[Tommyboy]

Thanks. This is the second time thru, we were blessed with a beautiful daughter the first time. Like you said it is a tough process that strains many things. I just don’t want it to be another item in the process for people to stress over. Don’t get me wrong it’s still a huge thing, but there is so much to it I could go on for days. I am sorry it didn’t work out for you….it’s so hard to take when it’s so easy for most everyone else b

We went through 2 times as well. Im sure your stories are alot like mine. It IS hard to take when so many can easily get pregnant. Keep your eyes on the prize and dont look back! The hardest part was convincing my wife it isnt her fault. Im sure you'll come out of this stronger than ever. Good memories ahead!