Nice rant BrockW. Everything you said still doesn't explain why Colorado and Wyoming still have strong deer and elk herds after 58 and 38 years respectively of having cwd. IF and I do mean IF this ailment is so dangerous, why haven't the deer and elk herds died off? Deer live what, 5-6 years in the wild and elk about 10-11. That equals 9 generations of deer in Colorado and almost 6 generations of elk. To be honest, I'm not buying the whole apocalyptic end of deer and elk scenario you and others want to put forth. In fact, I think the cwd argument is more interested in the money and political influence that comes with scaring the general public and particularly sportsmen into thinking all the deer are going to die. I say this because if you were really concerned about the deer and elk herds you would put an equal, if not more effort into the study and elimination of EHD. EHD is a real herd killer. When there is an outbreak of EHD, anyone can find the dead deer laying all around water sources. I found 9 carcasses on my own land alone when the last EHD outbreak hit ND with no problem whatsoever. Why can't we find the same thing for cwd? You love to bring scientific studies into this, but you can't quite grasp the fact that it doesn't matter how many studies you bring forth stating cwd kills deer and elk and claiming cwd will decimate deer and elk populations when simple observations indicate the herds are doing fine. All the banning, shooting, culling, astronomical tag numbers, special hunts, and whatever other hairbrained schemes were concocted to control this thing have FAILED MISERABLY! Interestingly enough, after all that and decades of screaming cwd is 100% fatal and will wipe out the deer and elk herds if not controlled, the deer and elk herds in those states with cwd are still there, still having fawns, and still doing what they do in spite of cwd. So, what gives? Why the full court press? Oh yes, now I remember. It might, could, maybe, perhaps, possibly affect people. Well after decades of people eating venison from herds that have cwd.............what happened? Are venison eating people stacked up in the hospitals and clinics? Maybe just a dozen or two? Sorry BrockW, I have zero confidence that cwd is anything other than a cash cow and political bludgeoning stick to impose an agenda on the public and particularily sportsmen. Go after EHD if you want to conserve deer and elk herds. More bang for your buck IMO. Carry On!
I think there’s some misconceptions in your “rant.”
There are some areas where deer herds are really struggling because of CWD. NW Kansas, Sask, parts of NE CO and Wy, and some localized areas in WI and AR.
I think we will start to see new areas like these pop up. But it will be a spectrum. Parts of Wisconsin and some of these states with insanely high deer numbers will likely be able to hide some of the impacts. But reports are growing. Areas with lower deer densities and more mule deer will see more noticeable changes.
Deer and elk can live longer than that. Multiple GPS collar studies show 13-14 yr old mule deer does bearing twins. Elk reaching mid to upper teens isn’t all that uncommon. But elk, at least in the data I’ve seen, seem to fair much better with this disease. Both at an individual level and at a population level.
I don’t think you should buy any apocalyptic end of deer or elk either. Again it will be a spectrum. Some populations get it really bad, others sort of stabilize at certain prevalence rates simply because of the size of the population and the ability for deer to reproduce even when they have the disease.
As far as EHD, First off it’s not contagious and it’s not 100% fatal. Deer can develop immunity and it doesn’t intensely affect mule deer, or elk really at all, and it’s temporary. Outbreaks are short and intense. But caring about CWD and EHD are not mutually exclusive conversations. The ND game and fish has participated in research for both diseases. There is ongoing research for both diseases. A vaccine has been developed for EHD, though it sounds like they’re still working out some kinks, and they haven’t gotten to a point where they can start working on a delivery system that would work for wild deer. But folks are working on it. Something important to remember with EHD. We know it’s been around for a LONG time. Documented instances back to the 1800s (virus wasn’t isolated until 1955). Deer populations across the nation have thrived in the face of EHD. Yeah, outbreaks have done significant damage in some locations and we’ll continue to see that. But they rebound because the disease is gone after freeze up. But again, overall, white tailed deer have absolutely thrived in the face of EHD.
CWD has only been on the landscape in high prevalences somewhat recently and the population impacts and dynamics are quite different. CWD doesn’t go away, there is no reprieve from this disease for cervids. It just sort of keeps getting worse and worse…. Very slowly.
I don’t think all efforts have failed miserably. I think your expectations were not in line with goals or predicted outcomes. I think it’s very easy to see some states have implemented management practices that have significantly changed course of disease compared to states or provinces that haven’t.
But I do get the heartburn over culling. It’s one I struggle with too sometimes. Has it been shown to be effective? Yes. But it doesn’t always work, and it doesn’t work forever. The sustainability of it is just not there. It’s hard for the public to accept (understandably) and even if it slows it for a few years or 10-15 years, after a while prevalence just seems to get to a point where culling isn’t as effective anymore. If you get on it right away and stay on it, it can certainly help. But like I said, once prevalence reaches a certain point, it’s sort of an exercise in futility.
I agree that it’s likely an extremely low risk to transfer to humans. But still a non zero chance. Prion diseases have jumped species before. That’s the way they work, host encoded prion diseases see strain emergence and host range expansion. But however unlikely it is, one of my greatest fears is that somebody does get it. Not even because I think it’s going to kill millions of people, quite the contrary. My guess is that if it does jump to humans, it will be like mad cow and only affect a few hundred people or something like.
But look at what was done with mad cow. 4.5 million cattle were destroyed over mad cow. Billions of dollars of economic damage, importation halts on meat, embargoes, it was a socio-economic disaster of epic proportions. And that was basicallly 30-40 years ago. Imagine what would happen if CWD is found to jump to humans or cattle today? You think the 5% of the American population that represents hunters is going to have any say in how the country proceeds? You think everyone’s going to ignore it? You think ranchers are gonna choose deer over their cattle? Non hunting folks are going to choose deer over their own kids? No, I think if that happens, hunters are not going to like the outcomes. Not one bit. I’m not trying to be an alarmist, maybe that never happens, but It already happened with cattle and BSE.
this is the exact reason summed up perfectly as to why almost 80% of testimony submitted and an overwhelming majority of sportsmen statewide arent buying this CWD narrative anymore either….people see right through it clearly now. It’s a money grab at the public’s expense through herd mismanagement and trampling private citizens rights. Good ideas and management dont need to be sold so vigorously and pushy…… good ideas sell themselves…… I told you Brock people were pissed…..
