Why is the youth deer season so short?

[SupressYourself]

Anybody that's been on NDA for more than 30 seconds knows I'm all about the youngsters. However, here's my question: How much privilege do you grant before requiring personal accountability, understanding, and responsibility?? What happens when that young person has "skies the limit" access and patronage and then in 12 months is relegated to "F you status" like the rest of the hunters?? Rewards without understanding are DANGEROUS! Youth seasons are intended to attract more hunters. However, when the glitter of youth and privilege are gone and the expectations of previous experiences are no longer there, I wonder if youth seasons may be doing as much harm as good. Just some thoughts from an old grey beard.

Interesting thought, but I would say that if anyone is relying on the state to teach their children personal accountability, understanding, and responsibility, they have failed as a parent. I tell my kids nearly every day that life is full of disappointment.

Some of you guys are going in some odd directions, which makes this interesting, but I think the "keeping it separate from other seasons" answer that a few have postulated is most likely, and makes a certain amount of sense. I personally don't think it would hurt to have it run up to the start of pheasant season.

- - - Updated - - -

It’s runs from September to January down here . Mentor can’t have a gun and does only. Never had a problem when my kid was little.

- - - Updated - - -

Think they got rid of age deal to

Yes, I know. I didn't want to mention that because I'd have no choice to point out another way that SD is better, and have someone invariably tell me to move there if I don't like it.

 

[1bigfokker]

You don't hear the kids bitching, just parents.

 

[Kentucky Windage]

I went fishing today. #$%^&>

- - - Updated - - -

Become ungovernable. Problem solved

 

[KDM]

I don't know if your lumping all youth hunters in the same category. I had 4 kids go thru the youth season. Not one felt in titled that they were going to shoot a big buck in there youth season and then after. I have since taken many young hunters out and watched them grow up. I never once felt the F you moment.

I hope one bad experience doesn't cloud your judgment on all youth hunters

Like I said before, I'm all about getting youngsters in the field. With the dozens of youth hunters I've had on my place both during the youth season and the regular season, there have been more than a couple that when they got turned down in their first tag lottery, they lost the spark and because it wasn't a guaranteed tag and easy hunt, they gave up hunting. I'm only making an observation that there might be a point of diminishing returns with respect to youth advantages. Right now I think the seasons are about right for youngsters in both opportunity and weather comforts.

 

[svnmag]

You should think about not Elk hunting one year on concentrate on the kid. But don't worry after their guaranteed buck tag they won't get another tag for years so you will have plenty of time chasing Elk.

Concentrate on the kid and be a teacher. Not a dick. Took me a couple years to master this concept. Years I won't get back. When one gets the epiphany a whole new world opens. After a while they begin to ask the reason for you not having a rod or gun. This is the time to let them off on their own and let them marvel at your skills as you direct them toward the best path.



https://youtu.be/SM0NQroxuoQ

 

[SupressYourself]

We found sucess last year. I'm very much concentrated on the kid. I could pretty much care less about shooting a deer with a rifle myself. I'm focused on providing him opportunities to enjoy the outdoors, which is why it would be nice if that window was a little wider.

 

[Maddog]

@KDM

Isn't youth hunter retention in the hunting arena for mentored hunts greatly influenced by parental participation after the fact?

I have done numerous youth mentored hunts and the only ones that have continued hunting afterwards are kids that have parents that then take an active role in going hunting with them.

 

[KDM]

@KDM

Isn't youth hunter retention in the hunting arena for mentored hunts greatly influenced by parental participation after the fact?

I have done numerous youth mentored hunts and the only ones that have continued hunting afterwards are kids that have parents that then take an active role in going hunting with them.

IMO parental participation is the greatest factor in new hunter recruitment. However, this can be offset somewhat if there is an adult hunter willing to assist for multiple years during that critical hunter startup period. If neither the parent or adult hunter is present, it is my experience that the young hunter is more than likely to give up hunting when it isn't a gimme. This is one of the main reasons I'm bringing up the possibility of a point of diminishing return with respect to hunting incentives. Without a solid foundation complete with positive reinforcement, longer seasons, free tags, or increased access may not equate to more recruitment in and of itself. Those resources might be better spent in say hunter education, high school shooting sports, or other youth focused areas where adult hunter participation is more available. I know this sounds anti youth, but it's quite the opposite. My hope is to get the most mileage out of the efforts to get more youngsters into the sport, but without thoughtful consideration of efforts, we as hunters may be spinning our wheels to a certain extent.

 

[Dirty]

I’m glad they have youth seasons and I’m glad they are set aside at a time when there aren’t too many other folks in the woods. I have never come across a kid bitching about any aspect of the youth season…only hear some parents complain…or more so adults with no kids. That just tells me where the interests of those adults truly lie…and I’m sad that they are potentially misusing the opportunity.

Just because the youth season is over, it doesn’t mean your kids can’t be out hunting with you and they don’t need a weapon or a tag for that either, but life is busy for a 11-15 year old and it’s busy for adults with children. As much as my kids love to hunt, they have many other interests as well. I don’t know if they could give up many more than the handful of days each year that they are hunting with me…part of that is my schedule and part of it is theirs. It’s a balancing act all 12 months of the year…more so in the fall than at any other time. When our plate is full, we figure out what we can and can’t sacrifice a little bit.

Get your kids out hunting with you if and when you can and then support them in everything else when you can’t. Hunting, like life, is about success, failure, opportunity, and lack of opportunity, the cycle of life, nature, balance, escape from the rat race, time with family, time for sharing stories, teaching and learning lessons, counting your blessings and it’s a great time to show your kid how important you value your time with them.

Don’t look for what could be and should be, just be damn glad you have the time with them you do have and make the most of it. Don’t use it as a time or a reason to complain, that’s my advice.

Throughout the entire 10 day youth season this year, I have two evenings to get my 11 year out with her first doe tag. I have 4 days I will be coaching one daughter in basketball and 4 more I will be coaching two of the other daughters in soccer. I have 6 days of work and they have 6 of school. Not a single one of us will be upset by the end of the youth season regardless of the results, and aside from me having to work 6 days, I wouldn’t change a thing because I love watching and being a part of them doing a lot more than just hunting.

 

[db-2]

I realize it hard for working parents so that is why the lucky ones have grandparents.

Have 10 grandkids. One i have never really know, one is only 1 and 6 i assume will not hunt leaving two granddaughters that are in this big time. Oldest i took on her youth hunt for a mule deer buck and also sat with her on her first arrow kill which was a decent buck.

The mule deer. i spent 6 days out there, found the mule deer's, uncle, my son, brought her out there and we made a 2-hour stalk, and the rest was history. The bow kill spent 3 days in stand with her before she connected. After the shot it was dark but still recorded the two of us sitting in the stand for about 15 minutes, pitch dark. She was down on herself for her shot and i try to get her back up and i am sure some day she will cherish that conversation that is on tape. I know i do. Tract it the next day and all was great.

Now the plans are in place for the second granddaughter. On the mule deer hunt with the first one she had clear it with the coach and all she miss was one practice. Well, she paid for that, but the price was worth many missed practices.
Coaches can be butt heads and sometimes they have no understanding of their role in a kid's development.

So, if you do not have a grandparent, find one for the kid. Life to short not to go for it. db

 

[CJR]

I really enjoyed the 11 year old doe season with both my kids. We got to be out in the field before anyone else and the deer had not become to wise to being hunted yet. We were able to take our time, pick out the right deer in the right situation and talk through the process at their pace. It was a relaxed hunt where I could focus on safety with them.
Its an early whitetail doe season so in reality shouldn't take all that long to tag out.

 

[SLE]

Anybody that's been on NDA for more than 30 seconds knows I'm all about the youngsters. However, here's my question: How much privilege do you grant before requiring personal accountability, understanding, and responsibility?? What happens when that young person has "skies the limit" access and patronage and then in 12 months is relegated to "F you status" like the rest of the hunters?? Rewards without understanding are DANGEROUS! Youth seasons are intended to attract more hunters. However, when the glitter of youth and privilege are gone and the expectations of previous experiences are no longer there, I wonder if youth seasons may be doing as much harm as good. Just some thoughts from an old grey beard.

I've hunted the youth deer season over the past 5 years with my own kids friends kids. The one week season is dumb, especially in the middle of September, but it is what it is. Hunting deer when it's 85 degrees out is ridiculous. You have a better chance of catching West Nile and a sunburn than anything.

I don't agree with this assessment at all, seems like a person that is pissed because they can't just get a tag every year. Our opportunity in ND isn't all that bad. The youth season gives kids a a chance to dip there toe with out being left in the dust by the adults during a season dedicated for just that. They get to have a few opportunities to build up to the buck tag and actually have a chance to experience some success in a controlled low pressure situation. My daughter was lights out on here first two does and then went 0 for 5 before getting her buck on the last Saturday of regular season. I think she hunted like 14 or 15 days when she had here youth buck tag and there were some dam cold mornings sitting on the hilltop. The following year, she knew here chances were slim in pulling a buck tag but I gave her the choice and she chose to put in for it versus trying to pull an almost guaranteed doe tag in the lotto. Lots of life lessons learned over those 3-4 years and with me not hunting at the same time, my focus was 100% on her just as it has been with the other kids I have taken out. every kid I've take all know that after their buck tag, it's into the real world with the rest of us.

KDM, riddle me this, if your not going to let the youth have a license to hunt and want them to join the lotto out of the gate, and they go several years with out a tag, how do you plan to teach them accountability, understanding, and responsibility? because they won't be in the field to do so........

Also whoever said the youth tags haven't been around that long must be like 80 years old. although it was different, I bet the program has been around for 30-40 years. Hell I remember getting a youth tag and that was 30 years ago!

 

[Dirty]

Ok, my memory sucks but the first youth deer season was maybe 20 years ago. The ages and parameters have changed a bit since then to what the season and tag options are now.

I was born in late 1978 and my first rifle season was in 1993 when I was about to turn 15 and it was quite a few years after that when the first youth season was proposed and approved.

 

[SLE]

Ok, my memory sucks but the first youth deer season was maybe 20 years ago. The ages and parameters have changed a bit since then to what the season and tag options are now.

I was born in late 1978 and my first rifle season was in 1993 when I was about to turn 15 and it was quite a few years after that when the first youth season was proposed and approved.

Well My birthday is within 2 years or less of yours and I vividly remember sitting out in the field with our neighbor guy in early season and getting a poke at a doe over a pair of shooting sticks. Outside of missing, where we were hunting and it being like 80 degrees, I don't remember any other details in terms of specific date but that was no later than 1992/1993. Then I had a youth "Any" tag the next year and went to the badlands and came home with a yearling the size of small cocker spanial, it probably should've still had spots, lol. I remember talking shit to all my buddies about the giant badlands buck I was going to shoot..........oh, the memories!

I will admit, as far as a youth season, that part is pretty foggy going back that far.

 

[Allen]

Also whoever said the youth tags haven't been around that long must be like 80 years old. although it was different, I bet the program has been around for 30-40 years. Hell I remember getting a youth tag and that was 30 years ago!

Well, I'm 56 (not 80) and there were no youth tags at all when I was a kid, you waited until you were 14 and went in the general lottery. The tags for 14 yr old kids were the first to come around, but the lowering of the age requirement to 11 is not 30 yrs, because I am pretty sure it wasn't an option when my now 16 yr old was 11, but it was an option for my soon to be 15 year old's. We've gotten to where we are in increments.

 

[Longtine]

Yep, I'm 51 and there were no youth tags at that time. However, drawing a tag was not the "event" that it is today. I remember several years of shooting four bucks a year (bow, muzz, two with a rifle). Even have a few photo album pages that have all four on one page! Wow, does that date a person......

 

[wjschmaltz]

Does ND allow youth hunter's under 18 to shoot parent's tags if the parent (tag holder) is with? That would be a good proposal that give the youth a bit more opportunity after the guaranteed tags.

I think AK does it right mostly. Under the age of 10, it's my decision when my kids are old enough and responsible enough to pull the trigger. They hunt under my bag limit. After 10, they can hold their own bag limit and own permits, but if me or my wife were to draw a good tag, we can let our kid hunt it under our direct supervision under the age of 18. There are a couple of youth-specific draw tags, but the odds are low. The big difference is that there are abundant hunting opportunities without having to draw a tag - however those types of tags typically require backcountry travel that a casual hunting family typically wouldn't commit to.

I figure that I got about 3-5 years of shooting animals and then my boys will be doing all the trigger work (if they want) besides a couple hunts here and there. I am completely fine with that. My oldest is 4 in October and I plan to take him with moose hunting in 3 years - it'll be up to him if he's ready to shoot by then and the requirements will be stringent.

Edit: I never had a youth tag. Started bird hunting a bit with friends in early high school. My hunting mentor was my uncle and I think I got my first tag when I was 17 (leftover doe) and first buck at 18. Things turned out alright for me.

 

[SLE]

Well, I'm 56 (not 80) and there were no youth tags at all when I was a kid, you waited until you were 14 and went in the general lottery. The tags for 14 yr old kids were the first to come around, but the lowering of the age requirement to 11 is not 30 yrs, because I am pretty sure it wasn't an option when my now 16 yr old was 11, but it was an option for my soon to be 15 year old's. We've gotten to where we are in increments.

Allen, I was gonna say your wrong on your 16th year old because I happen to have a 16-year old daughter of my own but that could come down to there actual birth date. I know my daughter participated in the youth doe season early on in her hunting career.


Side note, I was definitely not in the general lottery. It was a guaranteed youth tag back in my day and that was circa 93'/94' so I'll give in and call it 28 years ago and there was a youth dedicated season but I do not recall the limitations. So, I think we're getting closer, youth tags must happened somewhere in the 14 year gap between me and Allen.

 

[Dirty]

I did browse like crazy on the internet to see when ND first implemented the first incarnation of a youth season but damned if I could find it.
Now I’m extra curious to know when it was, as I am only certain it started after my first deer season. I remember the only thing I was upset about that first season…you either had to turn 14 before the season started or before applying (not sure which, but I think before the season opener), but my birthday is late November so I missed it by like 3 weeks. I guess it just added to the excitement I felt when I finally made the cut. It is possible that is the year it started but I was now too old to be considered a “youth hunter”.

 

[johnr]

Are speed goat apps due now too?