25 20 cal?

snow

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Curious if any of you guyz shoot this.

I'm sniffing around to upgrade to more horse power from 22lr,22mag or 25 20?,factory ammo availability might be a issue with 25 20, just getting started to check things out.

25 20 wasn't on the radar until recent.(rifle)
 


db-2

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Have a 92 Win in 25-20. Same gun that killed the Jordan buck. Also have a model 70 in 22 hornet k and a 218 bee.

Love them all but if i had to choose a caliber it would be the hornet. No reason why except as a kid, killed a lot of rabbits with the hornet. db

Bullets do not sit on the shelf, but they are out there. Just stock up when you find them. Get a rifle that shots the k bullet. May need to buy a regular hornet bullet, shoot the bullet in that rifle and reload. fireform
 
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SDMF

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Parent case to the .218Bee.

If you don’t already have ammo, brass, dies and projectiles, look elsewhere. It’s not that you can’t find it, but, it will take considerable effort and $$.

If you need more than a rimfire but you’re not going to step up to 223, the DB was right that the 22Hornet fills the niche.
 

Jiffy

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223 is just natural progression from the 22.

No need for anything else IMO
 

snow

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Thanx for the input, as a scatter gunner this is new territory for ole snow,22 hornet? Hmmm,more research,like the thought on ammo availability and affordability


What about .17? Big jump,im told 25 20 has effective range of 125yds

Seldom shoot m-4 .223 these days,looking for ideas something in-between 22lr small and large critter getter



22hornet range?
 


Lycanthrope

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223 is just natural progression from the 22.

No need for anything else IMO
I agree, very available, easy to reload, and also pretty easy to make fun reduced loads with. Ive got a bunch of data laying around somewhere about red or blue dot loads that have worked really well for me.
 

Lycanthrope

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Little searching found this, some of the original information I used when I was playing around more with reduced loads:
---------------------------------------------------------
This is for academic reference only and no claims are made...

Disclaimer:
use at your own risks... remember to work up if you do use any of these loads... and they only proved to be safe in the rifles I own... not making any inferences otherwise..


Blue Dot Range Report: 223 Caliber ( Full )

Bullet Weights Tested:
1. 35 grain Hornady V Max
2. 40 grain Hornady Vmax
3. 45 grain Sierra SP
4. 50 grain Sierra SMP
5. 52 grain Sierra Boat Tail Match
6. 55 grain Winchester FMJ

Rifle Used: Ruger 77 Mk 2, VT 26 inch Barrel, Stainless Steel First yr Model

Case: Lake City Surplus, previously fired

Primer: Remington 6 ½

Powder: Blue Dot

Charge Weight Tested: 4 grains to 14 grains.


Weather: Sunny, NO clouds, 80 degrees, NO wind,

Altitude: 2000 ft

Humidity: Very Low


Field Results:


35 grain Hornady V Max:

4 grs: 1284 fps
5 grs: 1488 fps
6 grs: 1862 fps
7 grs: 2163 fps
8 grs: 2392 fps

9 grs: 2636 fps
10 grs: 2722 fps
11 grs: 3076 fps
12 grs: 3205 fps
13 grs: NO Reading
14 grs: 3518 fps



Hornady 40 grain Vmax:

4 grs: 1161 fps
5 grs: 1538 fps
6 grs: 1798 fps
7 grs: 2148 fps

8 grs: 2243 fps
9 grs: 2539 fps
10 grs: 2771 fps
11 grs: 2956 fps

12 grs: 3013 fps
13 grs: 3218 fps
14 grs: 3375 fps


Sierra 45 grain SP

4 grs: 1239 fps
5 grs: 1447 fps
6 grs: 1688 fps
7 grs: 1880 fps

8 grs: 2118 fps
9 grs: 2363 fps
10 grs: 2553 fps
11 grs: 2811 fps

12 grs: 2875 fps
13 grs: 3008 fps
14 grs: 3164 fps


Sierra 50 grains SMP

4 grs: 1064 fps
5 grs: 1345 fps
6 grs: 1624 fps
7 grs: 1788 fps

8 grs: 2033 fps
9 grs: 2257 fps
10 grs: 2466 fps
11 grs: 2655 fps
12 grs: 2779 fps

13 grs: 2882 fps
14 grs: 3038 fps


Sierra 52 grain Boattail Hollow Point Match

4 grs: 1061 fps
5grs: 1460 fps
6 grs: 1632 fps
7 grs: 1916 fps

8 grs: 2142 fps
9 grs: 2225 fps
10 gr: NO Reading
11 grs: 2673 fps

12 grs: 2782 fps
13 grs: 2879 fps
14 grs: 3012 fps


Winchester 55 grain FMJ

4 grs: 896 fps
5 grs: 1264 fps
6 grs: 1568 fps
7 grs: 1825 fps
8 grs: 1994 fps

9 grs: 2201 fps
10 grs: 2328 fps
11 grs: 2453 fps

12 grs: 2677 fps
13 grs: 2821 fps
14 grs: 2915 fps



Notes:

1. IN the evaluation of the 223, I came further to the conclusion of the versatility of the 223 in the use of training new shooters, and for a very versatile varmint caliber.
2. Essentially the 223 can be loaded to the specs of a 22 Long rifle, a 218 Bee, a 221 Fireball, a 222 Remington, a 22 Hornet, and a 22 Win Mag., while allowing the shooter to be able to pick the type of bullet that he prefers.
3. Bullets were limited to use of 35 grains to 55 grains. Heavier bullets will not serve any purpose unless a 223 is to be used for deer hunting. I do not believe that their would be a significant difference in the use of a 55 grain bullet vs a 60 grain bullet.
4. The recoil on the lighter loads using 4 to 6 grains of powder had minimal recoil if any at all. These would be ideal for young shooters being trained.
5. Noise level on the lighter loads ( 4 to 6 grains) were on par with a rim fire. An increase in noise level was very noticeable above 7 grains, but still very acceptable. ( No sounding like a rim fire any more)

Noted Observations:

1. It was noted but not considered part of the testing, with a tree used as a back stop for some of the testing, that all bullets ( 45 to 55 grains)penetrated thru the tree at a distance of 20 yds.
2. The diameter of the tree was measured at 5 inches.
3. The 40 grain Vmax loads failed to penetrate the tree at loads above 10 grs, above 2771 fps. However at 10 grains and less, the bullets penetrated thru the tree and did a large amount of damage ( like turning the wood into tooth picks) on the exit side of the tree. The penetration stopped at the 5 grain load.


Some of the Author’s Conclusions:

1. I learned some significant items beyond the versatility of the 223 with the bullets tested, but focusing on its use in the field, got some ideas.
2. A light rifle such as a Winchester Featherweight or Rugers Compact model with a 16.5 inch barrel or the Ultra Light with a 20 inch barrel would make a good combo with the use of Blue Dot.
3. Since the powder is burned cleanly in the first 10 to 12 inches of barrel, the shorter barrels are not handicappiing velocity in the lighter shorter rifles.
4. The penetration of the 40 grain Vmax into the tree did make me ponder the use of those plastic tip varmint rounds as potential loads for small deer for youth shooters. Just like my observations in the larger calibers, the plastic tipped bullet seem to do a lot more damage, at velocities under 2700 fps. The Vmax surprised me. This is a decision any shooter will have to test on his own and make their own decisions. I am just passing on that I saw potential merit in the application.
5. Although one has to weigh out the potential of Plastic Tipped Varmint bullets on bigger game like deer and antelope, some of these loads in real life use, utilizing Barnes’s X bullets in 22 caliber I can recommend. They make a 45 grain, 50 grain and 53 grain bullet. The way I saw much better penetration and more damage in wood, at the lower range velocities, 2200 to 2700 fps, this would make a good deer load in many parts of the USA, and recoil is minimal.


I did not test any bigger bullets as I feel that those tested would be represent the best potential with the powder. 60, 63, 64, 65 grain bullets and then the larger match bullets did not give what I considered useful velocity when I have shot them before with Blue Dot, in respect to their field design uses.

Updated Feb 2008

cheers
seafire
 
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Jiffy

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A subsonic suppressed 223 load shot from inside the house a couple rooms back through a open window can't be heard from someone on the deck 15ish feet away from said window.

Or so my friend told me....

Great for rabbit control in enemy territory.
 

db-2

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There are all kinds of 223 rifles out there and all kinds of 223 cheap ammo. Join the crowd.

Old school:
92 in 25-20 made in 1917
model 65 in 218 bee made in 1938-47
model 70 in 22 hornet-k made in 1939, prewar.

No doubt the 223 will outperform all three calipers. Have a 223 in a model 70 and have not even bought a box of bullets for it let alone fire. Have one box of old 25-20 left. Shot enough 223 when i was overseas, junk, IMHO. Lucky to have survive.

Have a 222 magnum (mohawk) . Have 80 rounds but that can be a hard bullet to find.
Found as a kid the 222 bullets went thru the rabbit and rabbit hop off for 100 yards. 22 hornet the rabbit dies at the spot. But then there are no more rabbits.

So, for me there is nothing like taking an old school rifle with old school ammo and walking in trees knowing that i carry a rifle that kill the largest 5 point whitetail on record, maybe the only one doing that and maybe one day for me that 5 point. db
 
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snow

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Geez lycan,quite the informative read,thanx.

Local gun nutt in my town claims he reloads 25 20,didn't say what gr but claims 4k fps... Is this possible? Pretty sure he was working me to start reloading, im to lazy,after reading through these informative replies, thinking .22 hornet,store bought cost,availability.

Then move on to optics, have goodluck with "vortex" to date,open to suggestions on a medium budget up to $1k
 


db-2

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Depending on what you want yes there are better option. Made the right move not to join the crowd.
IMHO. I was trying to post a picture of those three rifles, and this came on and cannot get off. Some of last year's sheds. damn db






db
20231106_131606[1].jpg
 

snow

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Depending on what you want yes there are better option. Made the right move not to join the crowd.
IMHO. I was trying to post a picture of those three rifles, and this came on and cannot get off. Some of last year's sheds. damn db






db
20231106_131606[1].jpg
Nice db...dang puter's ...lol,im with ya.

What i think i need,.223 is to much,squirrels up to thinning local neighborhood of sneaky nighttime yotes,.223 would have the neighbors on edge late at night.
 
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db-2

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Thermal scope would be nice too. db
 


db-2

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I also hate when you get old, you have a small prostate issue, p more than normal, it has shrunk, after finding you pull it out and it has lost its stretchability, and a new issue comes along. And one cannot tell wife as she will buy some depends for you and no way, db
 
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snow

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I also hate when you get old, you have a small prostate issue, p more than normal, it has shrunk, after finding you pull it out and it has lost its stretchability, and a new issue comes along. And one cannot tell wife as she will buy some depends for you and no way, db
Chuckle....thanx.,oh don't forget the nut sack....haha
 

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