Compost vs. Screen Black Dirt for Garden

[ndbwhunter]

I'm building 4 raised planters to get my garden started. They will be 4x8x2 and each will hold approximately 64 cubic feet of soil. I can get some good screened black dirt that's mixed with manure for about $26 a yard. I'd likely have to wait until load restrictions are lifted and just get a full truck load since I'll also need some for landscaping around the house.

The other option for the planters is to use compost that sells for $5 a yard at the Bismarck Landfill. Obviously, it would cost much less to go this route so that's definitely a plus.

I've got access to a 14ft dump trailer, so I could do all of the hauling myself if I wanted to make a few trips. If the compost is a good option, could it also be used in the landscaping around the house?

Which option would you choose, and why?

After a little more research I've learned that the compost is necessarily good "soil", so what about doing a 50/50 mix with the black dirt?

 

[3Roosters]

Locate a rancher that wants to part with his horse manure and you are good for the garden. Welcome.

 

[sierra1995]

I'd go a combination if possible. The straight compost will be too rich (or too hot) and have too much nutrient, while the black dirt might be just fine as is, but mixed with compost could be really good. Same with as mentioned above, if you can find some sheep manure or something like that, that would be a good alternative to compost.

The soil where i am is very sandy so I had a load of black dirt hauled into the garden, then every year i keep adding my grass clippings to the garden. They get tilled in and break down with time.

 

[ndbwhunter]

Locate a rancher that wants to part with his horse manure and you are good for the garden. Welcome.

I could see adding that to some existing soil as a fertilizer, but I don't think I'd want to use that to fill the planters. I'm starting from scratch here, so I need some decent soil too.

 

[LBrandt]

Careful with landfill compost, could have a lot of carry over chemicals or weed seeds.

 

[Allen]

What Lbrandt said.

I believe there have been posts on here before about people planting things like tomatoes and taters into soils heavily amended with compost only to find out there's too much 2-4D and other residual weed sprays that really stunted their growth.

I tend to use peat moss and manure where I need to add some organic carbon.

There's always some local rancher selling manure on Bisman, I'd really suggest going that route.

 

[ndbwhunter]

It seems like the consensus is to go with a mixture of the black dirt and manure. Would an 80/20 mix be sufficient?

 

[guywhofishes]

landfill/city compost from lawn clippings is the devil!!! it will EFF your veg up from residual weed killer!

 

[PrairieGhost]

It seems like the consensus is to go with a mixture of the black dirt and manure. Would an 80/20 mix be sufficient?

Best idea. No to the compost.

 

[Lycanthrope]

Ive had good compost from the city and ive gotten bad stuff that killed plants. The good doesnt make up for the bad. Compost from the city would be great for starting a new lawn but I wouldnt use it for plants you want to eat, and it will occasionally downright kill your plants. Id do good black dirt mixed with organic matter, can be any kind of composted ruminent manure pretty much, also pine bark is a good additive and peat moss. If you have a source for shredded leaves, those are great also. Personally IM not a fan of raised beds in our climate because it is so hot and arid in the summer, most plants dont like hot roots and watering daily is a PITA.

 

[ndbwhunter]

Thanks for the information, guys. I know a number of people that use planters in this area that always have excellent results.

Any thoughts on the placement of the planters? I'd prefer to keep them in the back yard, but it's south facing so it will get sun all day long. Unfortunately, I really don't have many other options, as I don't want them in front of the house and I'll be putting a shop and parking pad on the west side of the house.

Do you think the constant sun will be an issue? I suppose it may just take a little extra watering.

 

[Ristorapper]

just my two cents. Daughter wants to get into raised garden beds so been researching a little bit.

found this article interesting.

http://www.gardeninginraisedbeds.co...ect-soil-mixture-for-filling-your-raised-bed/

I will also cast this tidbit: if you like sweet tasting carrots my father in law laid down a bit of SHEEP manure before tilling her up. Noticed several years ago Cashman's had it (bismarck) in bulk. Other places in bags.


Planter garden: We did this for the first time last year as our garden is only about 13 feet by 7 feet; enough for some carrots, cukes and one or two tomato plants. So last year we planted the shit out of cukes with pots. Soil was a blend of the current garden soil and peat moss. Planters were ones from the hanging flower baskets my wife would get for mothers day every year. Soil consisted of current garden soil and a maybe 20% mix of peat moss.

I have a dog kennel facing east up against a shed facing west. I HANG the hanging flower basket planters on the side of the dog kennel fence allowing the cuke plants to climb the dog kennel fence. Beings the dog kennel isn't used, I hang plants inside and outside. LARGER pots go on the ground on the inside. Train the plants to climb the fence.

Location is critical. The pots get morning and some afternoon sun. Then when the late afternoon and evening sun hit the shed the pots are shaded (generally during the hottest part of the day). Worked great for us. Gotta keep watering them or put them on a timed dribbler or whatever. They will dry out fast; if you are gone a week on vacation and no one helps you water, they'll be dead when you get back.

I liked the idea of hanging them on the fence of the dog kennel because the past two years in the garden we've been using the cattle panels for the cukes / tomato plants to climb on. Works pretty good. The fruit of your labor is up off the ground, visible to pick when they are the size you wish whether for pickling or eating.

good luck

 

[Lycanthrope]

Thanks for the information, guys. I know a number of people that use planters in this area that always have excellent results.

Any thoughts on the placement of the planters? I'd prefer to keep them in the back yard, but it's south facing so it will get sun all day long. Unfortunately, I really don't have many other options, as I don't want them in front of the house and I'll be putting a shop and parking pad on the west side of the house.

Do you think the constant sun will be an issue? I suppose it may just take a little extra watering.

I didnt mean to imply it cant be done, it will always be more work than an in ground garden tho... If thats not an issue, go for it.

- - - Updated - - -

just my two cents. Daughter wants to get into raised garden beds so been researching a little bit.

found this article interesting.

http://www.gardeninginraisedbeds.co...ect-soil-mixture-for-filling-your-raised-bed/

I will also cast this tidbit: if you like sweet tasting carrots my father in law laid down a bit of SHEEP manure before tilling her up. Noticed several years ago Cashman's had it (bismarck) in bulk. Other places in bags.

Used to get sheep poo from a guy south of mandan. He would load my truck box full for $10, thats a lot of shit! It was well composted and just looked like super rich black dirt, good stuff. Now I have rabbits so my manure needs are satisfied so I havent been down there for a while.

 

[BDub]

I have 85 feet of raised beds in direct sun. They do dry out but I find them easier to water. I lay boards across them and then move the sprinklers across them to adjust for the wind. I let them run for about ten minutes and then move them. There is always something to do while waiting. The raised beds have increased my production greatly and are easier to weed.

I used the city compost long ago without any problems. However I have been making my own for a long time from leaves. Never a problem with that.

The bad news is that manure is having the same problems as the city compost. Pastures are being sprayed and the residual effects are the same. The county extension has documented this.

 

[guywhofishes]

the newer “extended effectiveness” lawn herbicides don’t break down as fast as older formulas... by design

 

[ndbwhunter]

Anyone know where I could find some free (somewhat clean) fill dirt in the Mandan/Bismarck area?

 

[pluckem]

Id take full advantage of the raised beds your building and think of them more as planters/pots. Most don't put black dirt in planters, at least if you want the best success. You use a bedding mix.. some mixture of peat moss, vermiculite, compost, etc...

Depending on what is going in each one you don't need to fill the entire bed up with the mixture. Put down some gravel, pea rock as a base then some fabric to make sure you don't lose the bedding mix into the gravel, but allows excess water to drain.

Besides having weeds and plants at a more ergonomic height, IMO the main advantage of raised beds is it allows you to create a more superior blend of soil and keep it isolated from native soil. As well as providing fool proof moisture control (if you design it to).

 

[BDub]

I have used S&B for some of my boxes. Good stuff but unscreened. I actually didn't find that to be a problem.

Last year I purchased a couple of yards of a mix form a outfit east of Bismarck. Past Rocks and Blocks. It was priced right and worked well. I am adding peat moss and compost to it. It was a little heavy on the clay side. I'm not sure if they are still open but it would be worth checking out.

One year I snagged about twenty bags of black dirt from Walmart on clearance. That was in the fall.

The ultimate goal is too have soil that you can bury your hand into it. For the most part I can do this. It takes a while and lots of compost.

 

[sierra1995]

I got my black dirt from Northern Improvement in south Bismarck. Like above, it was un-screened, but I really haven't had any issue with it.

 

[KDM]

Match your soils to the veggies you want. If you want asparagus or other perennial stuff, find out what soils they like best and how to maintain that. Same for other veggies. If you are making the planters out of treated wood, keep in mind that part of the treatment is to prevent plant growth. Brick or stone holds heat which may be good in the spring, but not so good in July. Making the planters deeper than you intend and not filling them to the top will help with shade. If the edges are say 18 inches above the soil level, the plants may not get the full blast of the sun all day. For general run of the mill soils, I like the 80/20 mix, but have a way to incorporate additional fertilizers throughout the soil column as raised beds can become depleted after a few seasons. If you want melons or other succulent produce, I would consider adding some peat moss and do some serious thinkin' drinkin' on your watering designs for the whole kit 'n' kaboodle. Gardening is addicting so watch out. Good Luck!!!