Malheur Refuge Takeover Is a Wake-Up Call for American Sportsmen

[Vollmer]

[h=1]Malheur Refuge Takeover Is a Wake-Up Call for American Sportsmen[/h]
by Bob Marshall

View from Buena Vista Overlook in the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. Photograph courtesy ofJeff Sorn/Wikipedia Commons.
There’s plenty to be concerned about in this armed takeover of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in Oregon—and you many have read and thought about most of them. There’s the insult to law and order, which is the basis for any safe society. And there’s the idea that a group of our fellow citizens think they can shoot their way to victory when they lose in the democratic process.
Those truths are so evident in this episode it seems almost silly to even talk about them.
But there is one element in this incident that should alarm all sportsmen: The moral equivalency being granted this seditious act by some members of Congress and other elected officials. Especially worrisome and revealing is the support for that idea coming from the GOP presidential field. They might not agree with the use of weapons in this protest, but they are full-throated in their support of the demand that your public land—property you own and have paid to manage for generations and is the reason we have outdoors sports—be given away.
Regular readers of this space should not be surprised. My colleague Hal Herring and I have been following this issue for some time. And national sportsmen’s groups have spent years warning of the growing danger.
Unfortunately, as with many issues, the average outdoorsman—whether hunter, angler, birdwatcher or backpacker—has been sitting back, thinking, this can never happen.
But public lands policies are decided by our elected officials. I’d suggest all those who aren’t too worried about this situation spend a few hours checking the Websites of their congressional delegations, as well as those of the politicians running for president.
You’ll understand why it’s not hyperbole to say the Malheur National Wildlife incident should be a wake-up call for America’s outdoors community.

 

[Lycanthrope]

So this is good or bad? I thought this was all about some guy being punished for burning public land. What does this have to do with giving away public land? Arent they just protesting the unfair jailing of a rancher?

 

[guywhofishes]

See the Armed Protest thread in Politics for a clear and concise summary of the situation.

 

[johnr]

Summary?
If you have a week to take from working, and having any fun and want to put 70 hours into reading, and answering questions, then go to the political thread and have at it.

 

[guywhofishes]

Summary?
If you have a week to take from working, and having any fun and want to put 70 hours into reading, and answering questions, then go to the political thread and have at it.

Oopsie... forgot the :;: and the ::: on that reply. He he.

 

[Wild and Free]

Lets all listen to some facts here.



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A bit more here too.
http://ruralrouteradio.com/affiliates/monruralroute.mp3

 

[deleted_account]

killer ascot

 

[Account Deleted]

My take on it: I don't want massive chunks of federal land sold like one side pushes. The lands will be bought by the uber rich at prices I can't afford and I'll lose the access I have. Nor do I wan the the Federal government to acquire any more land for many reasons, mostly because they can't seem to manage what they have. I don't want any additional federal lands given the National Park/Monument designation because it restricts access. I want current BLM and USFS lands to maintain their long held current designation and that is "multi-use", i.e. grazing, logging, and sportsman access. Wish this didn't have to be so difficult.

 

[Lycanthrope]

I guess Im fine with grazing, as long as the public still has access to use the land for recreational purposes. If the grazing rights guys think they can restrict public access to the land, I say givem the boot... Anyone know the answer to this?

 

[Wild and Free]

All need to throw the notion and false ideas of this being about grazing rights on federal land, it is all about the government using underhanded strong arm methods of forcing adjacent legal land owners off of their property and expanding their own holdings period end of story.
No need to make it any more complicated than this.
Its going on all across the country, this one just became more prevalent because Amon Bundy who knows more about the constitution and laws of this country than 99% of the sheep stood up for our legal rights.

Same thing is happening all along the Texas Mexico border now too.
If anybody thinks they have control of their land within the constitution free zone which is a hundred mile line from the actual borders have some learning to do.
Do some research on it folks.

 

[Davey Crockett]

There's so much to learn about it that you can't put it in a nutshell. Personally, I think the armed protest is going to do me more harm than good. I respect the cause for it all and I respect my right to bear arms and don't like negative publicity about them. I think the armed protesters are educating uneducated people in bad ways instead of good ways.
I'm not so much the type to flash my guns to flex my muscles but I'll use them for my protection if I have to, I'll keep mine close and ready to use in a moments notice, out of sight and out of mind but that doesn't mean I don't feel any different about our rights as the next guy.

 

[gst]

Funny how this article seems to ignore the selling of these "public" lands to developers by politicians such as Harry Reid.

Funny how this article ignores mentioning the closure of some "public" lands after national monument declarations to public hunting.

Funny how this article fails to mention the closure of access roads on these "public" lands making hunting harder.

Funny how this article seems to want to divide rather that unite those that use these "public" lands.

Funny how this article ignores the fact and the truth the politicians they speak of want these lands to remain "public" lands open to hunters and others only under the control of the state.

Stop and ask your self this question, where would you as a hunter have MORE impact over how these public lands are managed regarding your ability to hunt on them, talking indirectly with Heidi Heitkamp or John Hovens staffers where you receive a canned response back or with your local representative you can look in the eye and hold directly accountable by standing at the legislature and voicing YOUR views?

 

[Davey Crockett]

According to the internet 37% of americans or someone in their household own guns, The other 63% in my opinion are uneducated. Of the ones that don't own guns , My guess is dang near all of them live in the inner city and hear or read the word gun more times in a lifetime than we do. On the local news in the inner city, hundreds of times a week Lazy thugs are reported to use them to make money, support their drug habits , and get rid of people they don't like, It's just the way they relate to guns. So now , You get a group of guns , Big ones and a lot of them flashing them at a protest for the media and the uneducated people embed even deeper in their minds that nobody should have guns.

 

[Fritz the Cat]

Bob Marshall is an advocate of the Land Water Conservation Fund whereby oil lease money from the Atlantic Outer Continental Shelf is diverted from the US General Fund into the LWCF. The money is used to buy private land and convert it to public land. Bob Marshall wants more federal land.

Measure 5 in ND was modeled after the LWCF and wanted to use ND State Oil Extraction tax money to purchase private land. The voters rejected M5 by an 80 to 20 margin.

Bob Marshall writes for Field and Stream. The article misses the mark.

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According to the internet 37% of americans or someone in their household own guns, The other 63% in my opinion are uneducated. Of the ones that don't own guns , My guess is dang near all of them live in the inner city and hear or read the word gun more times in a lifetime than we do. On the local news in the inner city, hundreds of times a week Lazy thugs are reported to use them to make money, support their drug habits , and get rid of people they don't like, It's just the way they relate to guns. So now , You get a group of guns , Big ones and a lot of them flashing them at a protest for the media and the uneducated people embed even deeper in their minds that nobody should have guns.

Davy, you are correct that we all operate with the consent of the public. Including what inner city people think. Let's expand on that. How do inner city feel about rural people and property in America's outback? Oregon is far away so let's pick something closer to home. This is a letter to the editor two days ago in the Trib:

[h=1]Dreaming up future N.D.[/h]




Print Email


January 12, 2016 12:00 am • DEBORAH GAUDET State College, Pa.

What do we want for North Dakota? Do we want boom and bust cycles such as the speculative cattle ranching in North Dakota’s past? More fracking providing short-term money for a few, and all that comes with it — crime, prostitution, problems with spills, water quality, air pollution, noise, contributing to global warming?
Imagine returning to how most people have lived throughout time, and how our ancestors lived — subsistence lifestyles, proud, independent and communal. The thing is, North Dakota is not the places in Europe from which most of our ancestors came. We could do well to consider history, and see what choices made in the past we want to rethink. Buffalo roamed freely on this land and thrived on the open range, while ranching cattle is marginal at best. In what ways are we constrained by the choices our ancestors made? Maybe by telling the stories we can dream up an inspiring future.
Imagine buffalo on the open range in western North Dakota, with wildlife corridors to the Black Hills and southeastern Montana, and people employed as guides, safety officers and in administration. A large wildlife area that would also provide habitat for elk, deer, ducks and other game birds. Imagine sharing administration of that land with the Lakota/Nakota/Dakota in the southwestern part of the state.
What an opportunity for cultural exchange, and for simply sharing the land. What a context in which to remember the tragedy of the Wounded Knee Massacre, 125 years ago on Dec. 29. Sitting Bull (Buffalo), killed Dec. 15, 1890, would surely smile upon seeing that day. Let us be holy as God is holy. God does not micromanage creation, but rather lets it flourish according to God’s design. Let us likewise enjoy and reap the bounty of God’s creation, and live simply without thought of exploitative gain.

Davy, do we shrug it off as musings from a crazy lady in Pennsylvania?

Inner city people come out here and see a piece of America they thought was gone. They go home with a desire to save the last best places, prairie, water, forest, wildlife. However, their vision for the last best places has no provision for the last best people. Rural people are not simply disposable.

There is our assignment Davy, if we don't tell our story, someone else will.

Democracy works, but it is not a spectator sport.

 

[PrairieGhost]

No doubt about this situation setting president. The grazing community is dueling thinking of the landowners they can take from the American people for their private use. Talking to people in Yellowstone yesterday and today they are watching this very close. Ranchers are nearly ways in some conflict even with our national parks. Think what hunting would be like for the average Joe with no public land. Some would like to keep you quite while the poison works.

 

[Fritz the Cat]

Think what hunting would be like for the average Joe with no public land.

The fed/gov is not selling or giving away any public land. I believe you already know that.

 

[Wild and Free]

The fed/gov is not selling or giving away any public land. I believe you already know that.

They have none to sell or give away anymore "which is why we have this ongoing and escalating issue, they need more collateral via land and especially lands with resources", Clinton took care of that while he was in office by signing some law putting all of our National parks and federal land up as collateral against our foreign debts that is why there are now United Nations emblems and signs at most all National parks but they try and hide them, one needs to look for them but they are there. All part of the "Private Public Partnerships" which is double speak for selling out to the Chinese and other countries.

This rabbit hole goes deep and has many spur tunnels.

 

[Allen]

fritz,

Ol Debbie there sounds like a card carrying member of the Buffalo Commons. And you are right, they are still out there and every now and then they find a bit of dumb and write a letter to the editor. Funny stuff.

 

[gst]

According to the internet 37% of americans or someone in their household own guns, The other 63% in my opinion are uneducated. Of the ones that don't own guns , My guess is dang near all of them live in the inner city and hear or read the word gun more times in a lifetime than we do. On the local news in the inner city, hundreds of times a week Lazy thugs are reported to use them to make money, support their drug habits , and get rid of people they don't like, It's just the way they relate to guns. So now , You get a group of guns , Big ones and a lot of them flashing them at a protest for the media and the uneducated people embed even deeper in their minds that nobody should have guns.

Perhaps we should just agree that those black scary "assault weapons" are of no value to hunters and agree to ban them as well.

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No doubt about this situation setting president. The grazing community is dueling thinking of the landowners they can take from the American people for their private use. Talking to people in Yellowstone yesterday and today they are watching this very close. Ranchers are nearly ways in some conflict even with our national parks. Think what hunting would be like for the average Joe with no public land. Some would like to keep you quite while the poison works.

plainsman. why not just be honest and admit it?

No one is asking ANYONE to be "quiet while the poison works". Actually the opposite is true and people are being asked to take the time to learn the truth. Not the distractions about ranchers or grazing rights, but about a Federal govt that is no longer controlled by "we the people".

So when this Federal govt has spun out of control, who will be most responsive to hunters and others regarding the use of these public lands? This out of control Federal govt or the state? Plainsman, when was the last time you sat down with Heidi Heitkamp or John Hoven over a cup of coffee to discuss something that is important to you.

When is the last time they personally returned a phone call you made to them?

Hell, I run into my legislators at the state level in Menards in Minot, basketball games, church suppers hardly a month passes I don;t bump into them. They have ALWAYS returned my calls or responded directly to my emails and a couple have even sponsored legislation myself and others proposed.

Bruce you always mention the "sage brush rebellion" What can you tell us a bout the "sage brush sisters" and their views on these public lands being used for hunting?

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fritz,

Ol Debbie there sounds like a card carrying member of the Buffalo Commons. And you are right, they are still out there and every now and then they find a bit of dumb and write a letter to the editor. Funny stuff.

Yeah I wonder what old Debbie thinks about prairie dog hunting on these public Federal lands.............oh wait that's right, you can't, never mind.

 

[Wild and Free]

Ha Ha you had to go and mention prairie dogs, now I am having a svnmag moment....................