Instead of College

3Roosters

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Just spit balling here folks, but wouldn't it make sense to TEACH, TRAIN, youngsters in middle school and high school to LEARN subjects OTHER than getting them ready for College? There seems to be a good percentage that have no aspiration of going to college so shouldn't the schools cater to those kids as well?? perhaps they do..what do i know? It seems to me that some skills that probably come into play throughout a person's life should be REQUIRED courses. ESPECIALLY for those students that PREFER a TRADE occupation or serving their country! Once again..spit balling here...but wouldn't it make sense to have some of the following subjects REQUIRED classes? Carpentry? Plumbing? Electricity? Welding? Basic Mechanics? Financial Planning(budgets, goals, balancing your check book,etc) Service to Country options..? Customer Service (patience, problem solving, teamwork, listening, communication, adaptability) Cooking? I know i know..perhaps many of these are already options... I was think more along the lines of making them required.
Me thinks persons going into the trade industry will be exploding in the coming years. But what do I know.
 


Davey Crockett

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Moorhead has a High School career center that's a great opportunity for kids that have interest in that kind of stuff. And it's not only for those who don't plan to go to college , college bound students need this stuff too. Some of you probably know the "Reds" , Twin brothers from Fargo. Matt is like a kid in a candy store looking at this program and he knows how important this type of education is. Not every kid is lucky enough to get to hang out at grandpas farm.

 

cooter00

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I believe all of that you stated is already offered at least it was to me 20 years ago my daugher is in 10 grade she is offered basic cooking and sewing plus woodworking in shop so I'm not sure what your looking for
 

db-2

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Had some of that in Vo-ag but could of use more. Bigger schools i been around offer a lot more. Basis Skills of taking care of things we encounter on a day to day living. And not just an option for the most basic. db
 
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3Roosters

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I believe all of that you stated is already offered at least it was to me 20 years ago my daugher is in 10 grade she is offered basic cooking and sewing plus woodworking in shop so I'm not sure what your looking for
Totally agree.. just wondering if more should be REQUIRED.
 

Bfishn

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Yeah the only thing on that list that should be "required" is some extensive personal finance which schools do have in some form I believe just not enough. Bismarck does have a Career Academy but not quite sure what is all offered through that. Maybe more things could be offered as electives through that but forcing kids that have no interest in trades to take those courses seems pointless and a complete money pit. It would probably be impossible to even find enough instructors for that.
 

Allen

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Totally agree.. just wondering if more should be REQUIRED.
I don't know how much I agree with needing welding or carpentry as required classes, but lots of schools have a Vocational Education program where such things are electives. New Town had a pretty good Vo-Ag, Meat Cutting, and Mechanics set of classes back in the 80s and 90s. I took both Vo-Ag and a couple years of auto mech. Never regretted it either, but I really wish I would have had the time for the meat cutting class. Not sure how much they still have in the vocational arena nowadays.

Personally, as a member of this forum and user of some other public social media, I kind of wish we could make some adults go back for remedial English courses. Seems to me that a lot of feelers get triggered with some poorly worded posts at times.

Overall, it's just tough to get the amount of time dedicated in class needed to make people somewhat proficient in all the topics available in the world today.
 

Sluggo

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At what age does the average person know what profession they want to pursue? Pretty sure most do not know in high school. Many guess when they are a senior and then fine tune their decision in college. I do agree that college should not be the only path to success and that learning a trade should and probably is another path. I think the sooner in life a person can make a decision about what they want to pursue, the better their chance of success.
 


BrokenBackJack

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In our little school in Cathay, ND, we never had Vo-AG, shop, cooking, sewing, or even a foreign language offered.
Wish we would have had a chance for some of that.
But we got a great education with a teacher for every 10 students or so.
 

KDM

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I think PARENTS should be taking the responibility of teaching their kids to be productive adults, how to survive in REALITY, and make good INFORMED decisions and the consequences of poor decisions INSTEAD of trusting someone else to do it for them. Just my opinion though.
 

db-2

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My one main reason for going to college was staying out of Vietnam. At the time had no thoughts on what i wanted to do with my life.

Got an animal science degree. No job offers and for the next few years did a whole lot of different jobs including chopping ice off the Red River for rail cars, tearing down telegraph line, farm hand and ended up teaching.
Then got an office job for the next 40 some years not related to an animal science degree. No thought of doing that job when i was young. It was a job.

At 76 i think i now know what i would like to do with my life but retirement came and i found that has suited me just well.
I commend those who have a set plan for their life as i never did. For me, beer and women. Took what came.
Small school like BBJ so would of like some schooling on living. Maybe some English as i hated that and it has haunted me all my life. People think your dumb when one cannot write or talk decent. db
 
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risingsun

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I think PARENTS should be taking the responibility of teaching their kids to be productive adults, how to survive in REALITY, and make good INFORMED decisions and the consequences of poor decisions INSTEAD of trusting someone else to do it for them. Just my opinion though.
This 100%. It should start and continue at HOME.
 

Allen

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At what age does the average person know what profession they want to pursue? Pretty sure most do not know in high school. Many guess when they are a senior and then fine tune their decision in college. I do agree that college should not be the only path to success and that learning a trade should and probably is another path. I think the sooner in life a person can make a decision about what they want to pursue, the better their chance of success.

Hard to disagree with this. I now work with people who mostly knew what they wanted to do ever since they were little kids to young teens. This helped them be focused on getting the education needed for their career. Financially, it's hard to argue against it when coworkers of the same age are making $XX,000 more than I, mostly because they have more time in service.

On the other hand, I tend to have a more diverse skill set and life experiences. This really does make it a tradeoff. Some days I envy those who can retire younger than I, other days I remember why they can retire sooner and I just sit and smile. Everything in life comes at the expense of something else. I honestly don't think I would trade my time spent in other occupations, even if it meant I could retire a few years earlier. At the same time, I vividly recall the moment I had enough of working on drilling rigs. I was working for a company called NICOR drilling out in the Charleston area. We were doing one of the rare directional holes (not nearly the same as todays!) back then and had a hole in the drill stem. This usually means you throw a bunch of crap (coconut husk, shredded hemp rope, etc) down the pipe to plug the hole and the jets in the bit, and then pull the pipe out of the ground wet. We were using inverted (diesel fuel based) mud and you would get absolutely soaked with that crap, and coming from deep underground it was bordering on hot. Well, it was the middle of February and a solid -30 degrees with the wind blowing as I looked across the rig floor at our motor hand, when I noted that he was in his late 50s or early 60s. At that exact moment I told myself "no effing way am I going to want to be doing this for the next 40 years". That weekend I had a conversation with a buddy who just happened to be the Marine Recruiter up in Minot. I headed off to boot camp about 7 weeks later.

I often wonder if I made mistakes along the way to where I am, and I'm sure that I have, but at the same time I try to remember what info I had available when making some of those life altering decisions. Inevitably I come to the conclusion that I would most likely make the same choices today if presented with the same circumstances. Career-wise anyway, personal life choices are another story.
 


Traxion

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I am nearly one year removed as a HS Career & Technical Education (CTE) instructor. CTE is the "new" term, vocational, go-ag, shop, home ec, are all outdated terms these days. That said, I'll lend my thoughts and try to keep it brief.

First, career guidance needs to start at home. Parents need to help their kids explore and develop their strengths and interests. They also need to be realistic with their children and understand that not every kid is going to be a neurosurgeon or professional athlete. Then, as they get to high school, be involved as the student signs up for classes. Don't let them throw darts at the wall or choose the easy courses. Too many leave this up to the schools and counselors and while they can and should help, the students need guidance from home first and foremost.

The second part of this is the fact that the state department of education (DOE) establishes what kids are expected to learn. Schools must abide by this. Most states are expanding CTE offerings and including them in the learning plans, but even still certain math, english, science, etc. must be taught. SD has a more CTE centered pathway to graduation, but it is still centered on the core academic areas. I can't count the number of kids who were reading Shakespeare but should have been reading repair manuals. But, kids do need a foundation of core coursework to do well in any occupation, so I support that.

There are other countries that "track" students into certain career paths early in education. While I see some strengths in this, there are also drawbacks. A student in a strong CTE program can often come out with skills nearly equivalent to a post-secondary tech school. But, many students have no idea what they want to do at age 14 and that is a huge life choice they must make. Many students also want to choose the path of least resistance and see CTE courses as the best way to do little. Good CTE courses are rigorous and don't fit this bill, but the reputation is still out there. I'm just hesitant to place kids into a box that they may not really want to be in down the road. I think if students and parents do their jobs, tracking isn't needed nor helpful.

I do agree with more life skills being taught, but it is a challenge given required coursework. I also see in this argument too many people thinking there is a pile of HS boys who just want to pound nails, fix cars, and weld. While there is that group, there are also groups that want to explore healthcare occupations, business, and other high demand career options. Too often CTE is viewed as the "vocational" end of things and it is so much more. I always told students that they would all live in a house someday. Though it probably made sense, I couldn't teach a course on home ownership to all students. So, I tried to integrate core home ownership items into my regular courses. I didn't have a course on electricity, but I made sure all students could wire an outlet and a light/switch. Our ag mechanics instructor made sure kids could change oil and do basic maintenance. Point is, integrating these types of skills into courses that affect the majority rather than the minority is more beneficial IMO. If a student really wants to weld, many schools have the programs to get a good basis to further their education at a tech school or with on the job training.

CTE education is about educating students to apply their skills in many occupations. It doesn't always have to be specific to just one core of kids. I'd rather have 100 kids in a HS that can change a tire versus 10 that can overhaul the engine.
 

Maddog

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I also tried to include our son in all kinds of "home" (wiring, plumbing, wall construction, installing doors, changing oil on the car, sharpening mower blades, etc.) and outdoor activities (hunting, fishing, shooting guns, etc.) when he was growing up. I was surprised when one day he called me up to thank me. He was with a group of friends who didn't know which way to even turn a bolt to loosen it, he remembered us going over that. Real minor but very heartwarming to know he remembered where he learned that. LOL
 

Skeeter

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Why does this need to fall on the schools? What happened to spending time with your kids and teaching them life skills yourself? Do we need more government indoctrination in a public school be taught? Here’s an idea. There needs to be way less influence put on sports and being in every club there is. Instead of being gone every night of the week and all weekend long traveling for some sport, Spend time at home with your kids teaching this stuff. By the time I was 13 I could change oil on every piece of equipment on the place. I could weld, and do carpentry.
 


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