No licenses for non landowners

[sbe2]

I dont usually get involved in threads like this because of the inevitable rabbit hole that it leads down but I for some reason that I need to say something on the issue. I am fortunate that I have a guaranteed place to hunt that has been in my family for years and have spent time taking others with that would like to hunt or dont have the opportunity to find their own land to hunt but that land is in MN and as you know it is much easier to get a tag there.

Being that as it may I have spent a lot of time hunting deer in ND and I must be rather lucky because I have never had much of an issue finding a place to hunt and have been fortunate enough to shoot some nice deer. I dont wish anything bad on any landowners and feel that it is their land and they can do what they see fit with it after all they are the ones that have paid for it or are still paying for it. With that being said I think that the people that do nothing but complain about landowners and complaining about them not allowing access for whatever reason need to do something about it. If you want hunting land buy some. As long as it is not prime farming ground land for hunting can be bought sometimes more reasonably than others and with the current downturn in some ag sectors some of the tougher farm land might be available again to be bought for hunting where it wasnt a few years prior. I understand that not everyones financial situation is the same but buying hunting land is a major purchase like anything else and sometimes a few other sacrifices need to be made to afford it life is all about choices.

Lastly KDM has offered to allow kids to hunt on his land a lot of years so he is providing opportunities for other people it is his land and his choice to do so. I think that threads like this can harm landowner relations and not do anyone any favors in the future when looking for hunting opportunities.

 

[KDM]

Thanks for the plug sbe2, but don't worry. As far as I'm concerned, the youngsters have nothing to do with discussions like this and I hope no landowner gets so upset that they punish the kids for the "Sins" of the adults. As long as I own land, at least a few youngins will have a place to chase deer every year. I've been known to let a few grown ups take a crack at a buck or two as well. Depends on how cold the beer is when they ask. (Grin)

 

[pluckem]

This isn't anything new or different from any other state, I think people in ND just don't have a clue how good it was back in the 2000's. The big game resource doesn't meet the demand.

The NDGF and/or the ND deer hunters need to get over the 60-70+% rifle success rates. Increase the opportunity to get in field by restructuring the seasons and tag allocations.

I lived in Iowa for 3 years. There they had 4 firearm seasons, residents could only choose and hunt 1 of the 4:

1.) October Early Muzz Season - 1 week long in 3rd week of October, lower number of tags, difficult hunt for trophy's because of the lack of buck movement during this phase. Weather was nice, pressure was low.

2.) 1st Season Shotgun - 5 day hunt - get first crack at it, but hunt is only 5 days long

3.) 2nd Season Shotgun - 9 day hunt including 2 weekends, deer have been pressured from first season, however you get more time and another weekend to try and fill the tag

4.) Late Season Muzz - includes 3 weekends in late December

It would have to be tweeked to better fit ND and the landscape, however the idea of having a number of different seasons with each season having positive and negatives spreads out the pressure and still keeps different options available for how people like to hunt.

Other thing is they don't have any of the firearm seasons open during the peak of the rut.

 

[Kentucky Windage]

This isn't anything new or different from any other state, I think people in ND just don't have a clue how good it was back in the 2000's. The big game resource doesn't meet the demand.

The NDGF and/or the ND deer hunters need to get over the 60-70+% rifle success rates. Increase the opportunity to get in field by restructuring the seasons and tag allocations.

I lived in Iowa for 3 years. There they had 4 firearm seasons, residents could only choose and hunt 1 of the 4:

1.) October Early Muzz Season - 1 week long in 3rd week of October, lower number of tags, difficult hunt for trophy's because of the lack of buck movement during this phase. Weather was nice, pressure was low.

2.) 1st Season Shotgun - 5 day hunt - get first crack at it, but hunt is only 5 days long

3.) 2nd Season Shotgun - 9 day hunt including 2 weekends, deer have been pressured from first season, however you get more time and another weekend to try and fill the tag

4.) Late Season Muzz - includes 3 weekends in late December

It would have to be tweeked to better fit ND and the landscape, however the idea of having a number of different seasons with each season having positive and negatives spreads out the pressure and still keeps different options available for how people like to hunt.

Other thing is they don't have any of the firearm seasons open during the peak of the rut.

ND residents would panic with a system like this. That's not enough time. People would be running down deer with their vehicles shooting them point blank. Haha.

 

[Timbuk-2]

"What happens if, for example, there are 2000 tags available for a unit, and 2500 land owners apply for a gratis tag? Does the NDGF issue 2500 tags or do they create a lottery within the gratis tag applications and 500 landowners go without? "

G&F is required by law to issue 2500 tags.

 

[Bacon]

I know some farmers doubled their income during the crp heyday simply by putting up another mailbox. Right next to their "posted sign".

What's your point?

 

[ShootnBlanks]

What's your point?

Maybe he wants to be a farmer too?

 

[eyecatcher]

This is why I fish. When I get in my boat, nobody can tell me where I can and cant go. Maybe when I win the lottery I will buy some land and start hunting more.

 

[deleted member]

What happens if, for example, there are 2000 tags available for a unit, and 2500 land owners apply for a gratis tag? Does the NDGF issue 2500 tags or do they create a lottery within the gratis tag applications and 500 landowners go without?

pretty sure its a lottery within the gratis because i know more than a few landowners who didn't get their gratis tags this last year and i am pretty sure they put in for them. but, i could be wrong.

 

[Enslow]

I would gladly pay the $30 for the gratis tag.

Just took out about 10 bushels of cracked corn again to about 6 different cat tail sloughs yesterday to scatter around for the pheasants. Probably about the 8th time this winter. They seem to be doing well also.

When i feed deer or birds i dont have to shout it from the roof tops. Why do you continually feel the need to self elevate on internet forums? Maybe you have self elevation cracked corn disorder or somethin... Just sayin...

 

[Davy Crockett]

Given the changes over the years I'm very surprised we have as many deer hunting opportunities in ND as we actually do. Back in the 60s my dad used to preach that hunting to feed the family is fading away and becoming a rich man's sport. So far he has been wrong but I don't think he was that far off, He just missed it by a few years.
It would be fun to run the numbers of deer vs hunters from then to now but as mentioned about the surveys , is impossible, they quit flying and counting. The only thing we are running on is a thin shoestring of some good dumb luck with healthy deer numbers in my opinion.
Way more hunters , way less habitat, longer seasons , Compound bows and rifles that can reach out further than a 30-30 and bait piles , we are probably still pretty close to the same amount of deer as there was back in the 60s ( In my neck of the woods anyway) No idea what your neighborhood was like in the 60s . We have had more and we have had less but all in all we still have a healthy herd in areas that will support them.

NDGF, landowners , Fellow Sportsmen will never be able to do enough to keep everybody happy . We've gone from a 2 1/2 day gun season and happy hunters to were we are now, Everyone wants hunting opportunities like their grandpa had and they want it for their future great grand kids too but sorry to say it just ain't gonna happen, It's unavoidable no matter how hard everyone tries. We need to work with what we have and make the best of it. There is no magic solution to the problem but working together to keep what we still have is pretty damn important right now.
I'm surprised nobody kicked me in the nuts over my poor people's tag ,My dad's opinion was based in feeding families through tough times, He lived the 30s and knew tough times and the importance of venison not horns and I share that passion , Call me a stupid prepper if you want but going hungry and living without meat would be a shitty lifestyle if times ever get tough again and that's not impossible.
Don't take me wrong, I have no problem with trophy hunters but not everyone shares the obsession to harvest two trophies per year while crowding out others that are just as hungry for deer and won't get a tag. I might not have a lot of "common sense" but I stand behind that opinion with true grit. We need to pitch in and work together to maintain what we have now for the future of our grand kids , We aren't dealing with a lake that once it gets fished out everyone will be able to jump in the pickup and drive to another lake to fish.

I do my fair share, I have till friday to get my CRP renewal offer in and it will cost me over$ 10 per acre every year than what I could get renting it out and I can't afford that but so be it, this will be the 4th 10 year contract if accepted, Between my wife and I we have received 72 gratis tags in the mail so far and I'll do what I can to keep getting them. If there is ever a movement in the direction to take away our gratis tags It should be replaced with a conservation tag or habitat tag with rules attached where landowners can be guaranteed a tag based on what he has put into conservation.
Hell, I don't even have a dog in this fight , If I wanted too I could harvest as many deer as I could eat and mount with little to no chance of ever getting caught. Not everyone's that lucky'
Everybody has an opinion and a reason behind it , I stick with what I feel is fair to myself and others. We all better get used to giving an inch because my dad was right, it's coming, It's just not here yet.

 

[Enslow]

Exactly where did I say the "needed my help" in a winter such as this? If you read, the corn left standing was for my benefit to keep them out of my hay yard as much as it was the deers. (the value of the corn may be less than the value of the ay they would eat and destroy)

So a couple winters ago when there was 3 foot of snow on the flat, how were the deer doing that YOU left standing corn for Enslow? The ones around here did okay, only lost a few dozen out of the few hundred that were in the yard, but did lose a few thousand dollars worth of alfalfa hay. (and no I did not try to get paid for it)

The "point" here is that there are things land owners that are actively engaged in agriculture have to deal with on a daily basis that others do not. In an effort to create harmony with the people who do (simply by ownership of land) have an impact on access, and deal with the impacts of wildlife, the G&F and legs came up with the gratis system.

When there are lots of deer no one whines about these gratis tag (well not too much) now that the G&F claim numbers are down it suddenly is a big deal because someone did not get a tag.

Some of these people don't see the bigger picture only that they did not get a tag.

some on here would like Bernie Sanders running the G&F giving out tags.

Where i live there has been thousands of acres left over winter to dry. The deer herds were not yarded up in those giant corn fields. My guess as to why is the coyotes have an advantage of sneaking up on them in the corn. Now the moose on the other hand spent all winter in the corn. I still am curious as to why you assume that i dont feed deer and that what you do for deer makes you special. I have eaten more tags in the past several years then i care to admit yet i dont feel need to publicize that on internet forums to puff out my chest that im helping the animals. People are frustrated because they cant get tags and it seems like you rather enjoy it. I hope im wrong on that part. Anywho the deer are rebounding and this should be a good fall. K bye.

 

[Davy Crockett]

pretty sure its a lottery within the gratis because i know more than a few landowners who didn't get their gratis tags this last year and i am pretty sure they put in for them. but, i could be wrong.

I think you're right with gratis lottery Not to open another can of worms or accuse anybody of anything,but NDGF also cracked down with mapping service and supposedly went through the applications with a fine tooth comb. seems logical and should be of a one time deal, Acreage does not change

 

[gst]

When i feed deer or birds i dont have to shout it from the roof tops. Why do you continually feel the need to self elevate on internet forums? Maybe you have self elevation cracked corn disorder or somethin... Just sayin...

Naw, just sharin a little something with the folks on here. I usually don;t speak about kids we take hunting or military of other folks we have use elevated heated blinds or some of the things we do to try and give back more than we take until people start whining about landowners on sites like this.

Yeah there are asshole landowners/farmers/ranchers. It seems maybe the younger generation there is more, but by enlarge most folks making their livlihoods on these lands are good people. And the same can be said about hunters, some assholes, maybe a higher percentage over the years, but most are good people.

What I find funny is that when I ask people if they have a doe tag and want to come hunt out of these heated elevated stands with deer running all over, most are more concerned if they can shoot a buck and get pissed when they are told I have three boys, myself, my Dad and a couple other long time friends and a couple relatives that hunt bucks but if they don;t mind shooting a smaller basket rack or something maybe they could.

Have met some nice fellas though a few years back stopped a couple older fellas in their 70's in a pickup that told me they had five doe tags. We carried a couple bales out to the end of a tree row and made a blind for them out of the wind and the kid and I walked about 150 deer by them. When the smoke cleared they had 5 does laying within 30 feet of each other and were laughing and pattin everyone on the back.

So no, don;t have any cracked corn disorder, simply amazed how people want to kick other people in the nuts and then wonder why those people won't let them back in their door.

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Where i live there has been thousands of acres left over winter to dry. The deer herds were not yarded up in those giant corn fields. My guess as to why is the coyotes have an advantage of sneaking up on them in the corn. Now the moose on the other hand spent all winter in the corn. I still am curious as to why you assume that i dont feed deer and that what you do for deer makes you special. I have eaten more tags in the past several years then i care to admit yet i dont feel need to publicize that on internet forums to puff out my chest that im helping the animals. People are frustrated because they cant get tags and it seems like you rather enjoy it. I hope im wrong on that part. Anywho the deer are rebounding and this should be a good fall. K bye.

You know the Indians call people that are bad hunters vegetarians and don;t really think of them as some conservationist helping the deer survive.

Didn;t "assume" anything, simply asked what YOU had done. Maybe if your neck wasn;t bowed so much you would have noticed that. Lots of people do a little more than others, it does not make anyone "special". So it appears farmers around you have fields standing with corn to dry.....okay like I said what I was left was as much ot keep them out of my hay as to feed them.

A thread was started on an issue that invariably turns into a slam to some degree on landowners and all that was done was share that some maybe give back a little more than what a lot of the people bitching know or even do themselves.

But hey it is a nameless faceless internet where people hide behind computer screens and say crap they likely would not have the balls ot say otherwise. I would bet most on here bitching have not taken the time to travel to Bismarck and testify when this issue comes up. So hope your feelers were not hurt to bad in a thread most everyone knew would end up where they all do.

 

[eyexer]

If you don't like it go buy some land and pay taxes on it every year. Between my dad and I we pay over 15k a year for our gratis tags plus we feed them. If anyone wants to pitch in your more than welcome to hunt it.:;:stirthepot

how many quarters of land do you own?

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[Davy Crockett]

haha, Good eye eye Thumbs Up

 

[Enslow]

Naw, just sharin a little something with the folks on here. I usually don;t speak about kids we take hunting or military of other folks we have use elevated heated blinds or some of the things we do to try and give back more than we take until people start whining about landowners on sites like this.

Yeah there are asshole landowners/farmers/ranchers. It seems maybe the younger generation there is more, but by enlarge most folks making their livlihoods on these lands are good people. And the same can be said about hunters, some assholes, maybe a higher percentage over the years, but most are good people.

What I find funny is that when I ask people if they have a doe tag and want to come hunt out of these heated elevated stands with deer running all over, most are more concerned if they can shoot a buck and get pissed when they are told I have three boys, myself, my Dad and a couple other long time friends and a couple relatives that hunt bucks but if they don;t mind shooting a smaller basket rack or something maybe they could.

Have met some nice fellas though a few years back stopped a couple older fellas in their 70's in a pickup that told me they had five doe tags. We carried a couple bales out to the end of a tree row and made a blind for them out of the wind and the kid and I walked about 150 deer by them. When the smoke cleared they had 5 does laying within 30 feet of each other and were laughing and pattin everyone on the back.

So no, don;t have any cracked corn disorder, simply amazed how people want to kick other people in the nuts and then wonder why those people won't let them back in their door.

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You know the Indians call people that are bad hunters vegetarians and don;t really think of them as some conservationist helping the deer survive.

Didn;t "assume" anything, simply asked what YOU had done. Maybe if your neck wasn;t bowed so much you would have noticed that. Lots of people do a little more than others, it does not make anyone "special". So it appears farmers around you have fields standing with corn to dry.....okay like I said what I was left was as much ot keep them out of my hay as to feed them.

A thread was started on an issue that invariably turns into a slam to some degree on landowners and all that was done was share that some maybe give back a little more than what a lot of the people bitching know or even do themselves.

But hey it is a nameless faceless internet where people hide behind computer screens and say crap they likely would not have the balls ot say otherwise. I would bet most on here bitching have not taken the time to travel to Bismarck and testify when this issue comes up. So hope your feelers were not hurt to bad in a thread most everyone knew would end up where they all do.

I see you took another opportunity to elevate yourself. Good deeds mean alot more when you dont publicize them... Just sayin..

 

[gst]

I put a baby bird back up in it's nest last spring and held the door open for an older lady just two days ago too.

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You are goin to have to get to the chiropractor for that bow in your neck pretty soon there enslow..........

 

[SDMF]

I put a baby bird back up in it's nest last spring and held the door open for an older lady just two days ago too.

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You are goin to have to get to the chiropractor for that bow in your neck pretty soon there enslow..........

You must be lobbying to get into Bernie's cabinet as landowner Czar.

 

[Enslow]

I put a baby bird back up in it's nest last spring and held the door open for an older lady just two days ago too.

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You are goin to have to get to the chiropractor for that bow in your neck pretty soon there enslow..........

Bow in my neck haha wtf are you talking about? Is this your socieopathic way of redirecting the conversation? Why not just relax and not argue? Sometimes even old asshole dogs can learn new tricks haha.