SB 2309 Youth Muley Doe

[deleted user]

More ballot box biology from Rep. Boehm who has been pretty anti-game and fish since he showed up. But the conspiracy theory here is the game and fish is screwing the mule deer population for an extra $400 in youth tags?

 

[Trip McNeely]

whoa look at you big shooter comin in all defensive and shit. What if I told you there is already a law in the books for disease management for animals in nd….. there are protocols and laws in place now that give the governor and state vet authority to enact said laws if an actual outbreak of any infectious disease occurs……didnt know that did you? Apparently the game and fish doesnt either…..or maybe they do…… and the professionals don’t trust the professionals in this case weird how when you dig into things the more you learn things…… dont believe me…. start digging into the century code……sounds to me more like “professionals” trying to supercede protocols already written and established into law. Wouldn’t that be the definition of a rouge agency?

 

[Trip McNeely]

Fuck the kids, we need to save the mule deer. But I'm going to fight like hell to make sure I can sit by a bait pile and shootem. No hunting license, just shooting license needed

Well if you didn’t live in the flattest part of ND you’d probably understand that using bait for mule deer isnt a very effective approach to hunting them as they are more sporadic and less predictable

 

[Trip McNeely]

More ballot box biology from Rep. Boehm who has been pretty anti-game and fish since he showed up. But the conspiracy theory here is the game and fish is screwing the mule deer population for an extra $400 in youth tags?

It’s not about money. It’s about killing as many deer as possible disguised as “opportunity” there’s one side here that wants more deer. The other side claims they do but their actions don’t not line up with their words in any way shape or form. If you want to grow mule deer numbers you stop killing does period. Everyone knows whitetails are more adaptable and can rebound faster from low numbers and can adapt to changing environments easier.

 

[deleted user]

Then why would Boehm, sponsor of 2137, sponsor this bill?

 

[Trip McNeely]

My guess is it is purely intended for youth involvement or an idea from members of his district and made with good intentions. That said I think I don’t think it’s a very good idea if we’re looking at the bigger picture for mule deer in ND. I could take you to a couple places in ND where very little if any muley doe harvest occurs and I’ll show you robust mule deer herds. A lot better than “state” managed herds.

 

[woodduck30]

Well if you didn’t live in the flattest part of ND you’d probably understand that using bait for mule deer isnt a very effective approach to hunting them as they are more sporadic and less predictable

I never said to bait mule deer. Here is what effective mule deer hunting looks like. My first tactic is to drive up to them and shoot one. My second tactic is to walk up to them and shoot one. I have never had to use tactic 2, because tactic 1 always works.

I have never bow hunted them. Maybe then I would need tactic 2, maybe

 

[1lessdog]

I am all for an antlerless youth season(s) when the deer population allows for it. Killing more antlerless mule deer and even whitetails at this point, when our herd is darn near at historic lows makes zero management sense to me. Habitat is key but the tree rows/abandon farm yards of yester years are never coming back.

I agree on managing the deer herds, but I don't think the kids are going to reduce the herd that much. If so take that # of tags out of the general lottery. I would much rather see a young hunter shooting a doe than a 30 yr old man. And the time of year for the youth season in N.D. is terrible. All the row crops are standing. The temps can be hot. But I do agree the Mule Deer Does can be very dumb. And no nonresident. Which I think is a mistake.

I like the S.D. Mentor season. Starts Sept 1st and end at the end of the year. And only does can be taken. Nonresident can get tags and hunt

The MN youth season is always teacher conversations 3 weekend of Oct. So opens on Thursday and closes on Sunday. And the youth hunters can shoot bucks or does. And can buy bonus tags to shoot a extra doe or two. Nonresident can get tags and also shoot bucks and does and get bonus tags.

 

[Trip McNeely]

I can agree with the above. I guess it all depends on one of three categories. 1) deer numbers are lower than you want= stop killing does 2) stable and around where you want = Limited number of tags for does of which youth tags count towards. 3) too many deer= increased tags to reduce numbers…… IMO we are at number 1 and the game and fish is letting number 3 rip like KDM said we give an opportunity now which takes 20 opportunities away from lack of productivity of that dead doe. Im all for the youth and opportunities but from what I’ve seen in the badlands the last few years mule deer numbers arent very great.

 

[1lessdog]

The whiteatail population in many areas is in the shitter after they were wiped out by EHD and G & F reduced tags somewhat, but not to near the extent they should have. This is the next best answer? Kill a bunch of mule deer does? Cant wrap my head around this one...

If N.D. didn't ever have another outbreak of EHD the Whitetail population would never rebound anyway. There is no habitat to support a growing population. It's not hunters, it's no habitat.

 

[Eatsleeptrap]

Eliminate the apprentice tags altogether. Kill two birds with one stone. We will not shoot mule deer does and also will quit spoiling soft, snot nosed kids. Go back to the original youth season. HUNTER'S SAFETY REQUIRED, then the nine and a half day season at the end of September for 14 year old's. Any whitetail, restricted to the unit they will hunt in November if the youth tag is unfilled. I have grandkids. If the son in law even talks about an apprentice tag, he is getting tagged alright, right in the hairy bean bag.

 

[Ruttin]

Well the bill passed yesterday. I apologize on being a day late. Only way it doesn't get through now is with a governor veto.

I received a confirmation from "my" representative.

 

[Narcs]

From a hunting perspective, this state continues to go downhill faster than a giant slalom skier. Just when ya think the industrial/agricultural/political super majority can’t screw up anything else, they surprise ya!! Twilight zone kind of shit.

 

[wct12]

Devils advocate here...

I heard testimony on this bill while I was waiting to testify on 2137. If I remember correctly I think the department even testified in favor of it. It was testified on as an opportunity bill because in some areas the whitetail population was all but wiped out due to EHD and winter loss, but the muley population didn't take quite the hit the whitetails did from EHD. Kids were going in the field in those areas (close to home) and not seeing a single whitetail deer, but multiple mule deer.

I'm all in favor of giving youth more opportunity as long as the department can manage the herd correctly (I don't think that manage it correctly as is and have been very critical of the NDGF big game department). I honestly would be in favor of taking youth doe tags out of the general license allocation to increase hunter involvement even if it meant increasing a year or 2 between tag draws personally. But I also don't want to see populations hurt any worse than they are at the moment.

One of the cooler things I've heard on youth hunting involvement I hope was true (not sure if it is as I haven't fact checked) is that montana awards a deer license to every resident and nonresident youth under 16 is what I was told (I don't want nodak to do nonresident at all because of our deer numbers but neat of montana if it's true). If its a way to get youth involved while managing populations for the betterment and the department can figure that out, I'm all in favor of it.

 

[1lessdog]

Eliminate the apprentice tags altogether. Kill two birds with one stone. We will not shoot mule deer does and also will quit spoiling soft, snot nosed kids. Go back to the original youth season. HUNTER'S SAFETY REQUIRED, then the nine and a half day season at the end of September for 14 year old's. Any whitetail, restricted to the unit they will hunt in November if the youth tag is unfilled. I have grandkids. If the son in law even talks about an apprentice tag, he is getting tagged alright, right in the hairy bean bag.

I think the apprentice lic is the least of a sportsman worry. So you have a problem with a son in law get over it. If he get a apprentice lic and likes it. It's a win for your grandkids. If you act like a jerk your grandkids may never get a chance to hunt. Your son in law could tell you to take a shit.

 

[1lessdog]

Devils advocate here...

I heard testimony on this bill while I was waiting to testify on 2137. If I remember correctly I think the department even testified in favor of it. It was testified on as an opportunity bill because in some areas the whitetail population was all but wiped out due to EHD and winter loss, but the muley population didn't take quite the hit the whitetails did from EHD. Kids were going in the field in those areas (close to home) and not seeing a single whitetail deer, but multiple mule deer.

I'm all in favor of giving youth more opportunity as long as the department can manage the herd correctly (I don't think that manage it correctly as is and have been very critical of the NDGF big game department). I honestly would be in favor of taking youth doe tags out of the general license allocation to increase hunter involvement even if it meant increasing a year or 2 between tag draws personally. But I also don't want to see populations hurt any worse than they are at the moment.

One of the cooler things I've heard on youth hunting involvement I hope was true (not sure if it is as I haven't fact checked) is that montana awards a deer license to every resident and nonresident youth under 16 is what I was told (I don't want nodak to do nonresident at all because of our deer numbers but neat of montana if it's true). If its a way to get youth involved while managing populations for the betterment and the department can figure that out, I'm all in favor of it.

S.D and MN both allow nonresident youth hunters to. N.D. needs to get on the ball. If the youth hunters can't even get a chance to shoot a deer. It's pretty easy for them to give up on hunting all together.

 

[Trip McNeely]

Taking it out of the allocated tags would be the best scenario. I can get on board with the youth tag and the idea behind youth recruitment but I think we gotta take a cautious approach in regards to mule deer.

 

[Ruttin]

S.D and MN both allow nonresident youth hunters to. N.D. needs to get on the ball. If the youth hunters can't even get a chance to shoot a deer. It's pretty easy for them to give up on hunting all together.

Easy to say when you live in MN. Come to ND and look at the landscape. If every landowner in ND applied for a gratis tag under the current laws I'd be surprised if there would be any deer tags left for the tax paying public.

 

[1lessdog]

Easy to say when you live in MN. Come to ND and look at the landscape. If every landowner in ND applied for a gratis tag under the current laws I'd be surprised if there would be any deer tags left for the tax paying public.

Are you paying the landowner property tax? I didn't think so, and what are you contributing to the state to make hunting better.

Plus I do hunt N.D. a lot bird and bow hunting.

 

[huntemup]

While everyone is worried about the deer populations do the smart and most fair thing and close the season down for a two year period and let the amount of deer increase for those that are complaining the most. If adults haven't shot enough deer in their lifetime that they want to restrict the kids then should maybe find a different sport.