One tag system

[You]

Davey, under your no dog in this fight push for a 1 tag system, there still aren't enough tags for every td&h to hunt their home/desired unit, you've solved nothing (what, they're waiting 5 years now instead of 6?) but you've crushed interest in archery, muzzloading, and even some rifling (as they've now moved exclusively bow/muzz).

it's not good for team outdoorsman. it's not good for recruitment.

the numbers don't lie and a one tag system definitely hurts more than it helps.

more deer will die in a 1 tag system as well. g&f is always going to sell xyz amount of tags but with some people 'only' having one, it'll motivate them far more to fill it.

one example/scenario are people who fill their rifle tag then suddenly lose their motivation to go out in the cold for muzz or bow since they already have their meat.

 

[lunkerslayer]

This is the part I just cant seem to get through my thick skull or yours (one of us is wrong and if it's me I'll admit it) and the only reason I thought this topic was worth discussion. Rounding off the numbers in this poll to make an easy example to work with, lets say 100 people wanted to shoot a deer and 50 of them got a license , 20 people got two license and 20 got none . So 70 out of 100 get to shoot a deer Now you do the math and tell me how many people could go hunting with a 1 tag system because I keep coming up with the same number and everyone is telling me I am wrong.

Good post Davey let's see if you get an answer i hve been waiting for someone to catch on to what you were originally trying to show with your analogy. The numbers only work if you are willing to spend more then what it's worth to put meat in the freezer. If you are out for more then meat in the freezer then the system doesn't work for everyone who wants a chance to shoot a deer in thier local deer unit.
I for one don't care for the system the way it is, I can't do anything about it other then wait for my name to be drawn. The only area I do see a change is needed is the minimum acreage should be increased to one section of land.
Also remember when deer season in some units were broken up into late and early hunting season why can't this be brought back.

 

[luvcatchingbass]

That is the best you can do? SMH... I don't think I wrongly accused anyone. If you can't see how a system that gives half the available tags away before anyone gets a chance at a draw is hurting the future of hunting, you are part of the problem too.

I'm guessing referring to landowner gratis. Please elaborate on how it is such a major problem

 

[lunkerslayer]

Ps maybe we need to get rid of baiting deer how many bow hunters on here shoot from under pile of feed.

 

[You]

gratis at 160 is a huge problem. it will slowly turn it into a richer man's game. I know of too many people who bought 160 just to get that gratis. none are farmers.

I think the intent of the gratis system is to show a bit of appreciation/understanding/compassion towards legit farmers who have to deal with losses due to game depredation.

 

[lunkerslayer]

gratis at 160 is a huge problem. it will slowly turn it into a richer man's game. I know of too many people who bought 160 just to get that gratis. none are farmers.

I think the intent of the gratis system is to show a bit of appreciation/understanding/compassion towards legit farmers who have to deal with losses due to game depredation.

Atleast some can agree on this but some will complain they can complain with the rest of us who don't have any land or who only own 160. Not kidding




Also nomore hunting under a feed pile and let do away with scopes. Then atleast we can keep the tag system as is.

I am kidding

 

[luvcatchingbass]

Yes I understand that it removes tags from a lottery but how do you plan to change that rule of which landowners get a tag. Increase acre amount, limit number of family members allowed, limit overall gratis numbers per unit/separate gratis lottery?
Our family only takes 1 but a few years ago when my dad and I both put in (WE ALSO never doubled up on land, we hunted separate areas) I was told 1 per family and my dad relinquished his to me. So the last time I got to hunt with my father was about 5yrs ago, he now has parcasins and can't safely handle a large caliber. So our district warden made the decision for us and we just apply for one tag, sure dad and I still spend time but with the clock ticking my goal was to bow hunt and help him fill one at least last deer tag and never knew till 2 days before season what he had done.

 

[dust in the wind]

.....

Yep, it would add tags into the lottery - I overlooked that. So lets run with that idea with your numbers.

54000 tags
105000 applicants


51.5% of applicants getting a tag.




64000 tags (10,000 more tags)
95000 applicants (10,000 fewer applicants)


67% applicants get tags - this sounds great on an overall basis.




This still only amounts to approximately a .39% increase in odds avg in each unit. This is still not a drastic improvement in odds in getting tag. You might shave 1 year off of a 4 year wait.


In response to your statement - you talk about hunting in a preferred rifle unit which you have stated as part of your argument but many have told gun hunters to apply in other units which you appear unwilling to do but have no problem with others having to make that choice --- and --- you seem to want to put more limits on gun hunters but are unwilling to limit bow hunters
I have had others tell me to apply in other units as well - even on the left over doe tags. I thought about it but decided not to. It was my choice not to do that. I'm also NOT complaining about not having a rifle tag!

You are missing my point - if this were to go through, I would expect rifle hunters to suggest some give on their part as well. After all, the overall goal of this proposal was to provide more opportunity for rifle hunting for more people sooner. What better way than a little give from bow hunters and rifle hunters - right?


as for this comment - the G&F proposal was set up to impact bow hunters the least by allowing them to purchase a tag after the drawing or use their rifle tag during bow season


Yep I know that and you know what - I may still apply in the rifle lottery just because, and take a chance that I get a rifle tag. I honestly haven't figured out what I would do if this ever came to be.

 

[luvcatchingbass]

The 160 mark is a little low I feel. I also know a few that did the same and let's just say they are not very trustworthy neighbors at times

 

[JMF]

That is the best you can do? SMH... I don't think I wrongly accused anyone. If you can't see how a system that gives half the available tags away before anyone gets a chance at a draw is hurting the future of hunting, you are part of the problem too.

Yeah you did. You assumed he got a gratis tag every year and therefore was part of the problem in your scenario. So tell me, where do you suppose the majority of deer hunters will hunt when you piss off land owners by taking away gratis tags? There sure as hell isnt enough public land. I would entertain the idea of raising the minimum from 150 acres to 600.

 

[dust in the wind]

This is the part I just cant seem to get through my thick skull or yours (one of us is wrong and if it's me I'll admit it) and the only reason I thought this topic was worth discussion. Rounding off the numbers in this poll to make an easy example to work with, lets say 100 people wanted to shoot a deer and 50 of them got a license , 20 people got two license and 20 got none . So 70 out of 100 get to shoot a deer Now you do the math and tell me how many people could go hunting with a 1 tag system because I keep coming up with the same number and everyone is telling me I am wrong.

Your example would make it seem pretty obvious that you could have had more people hunting however, in your poll we have 26% getting 2 tags. Do we know how many of those included a gratis tag as 1 of them? No we don't. Do we know how many might have been rifle and muzzeloader tags? No we don't. Do we know how many were bow and rifle combinations? No we don't. Do we know how many were Bow and Muzzleloader tags? No we don't.

We cannot assume that we have 20 to 26% of hunters have a bow tag and non gratis rifle tag.

I would imagine that since it is an unscientific poll - there could be shenanigans happening and the numbers are skewed.

 

[Kurtr]

And dinks from SD answered in the poll

 

[dust in the wind]

And dinks from SD answered in the poll

Getting almost as bad as the sconis...... Just Kidding!

 

[Huskerdu]

Gratis for me, lots of deer this year, saw a lot of good bucks , coming off of the blue tongue, should get better , loss of CRP is a factor for recovery

 

[lunkerslayer]

So we got no baiting, no scopes over 20 power, 640 acres, and get rid of hunting guides in units with more private land. Then we can keep the tag system as is:;:cheers

- - - Updated - - -

Gratis for me, lots of deer this year, saw a lot of good bucks , coming off of the blue tongue, should get better , loss of CRP is a factor for recovery

What unit do you hunt

 

[luvcatchingbass]

All I know is that there is doubt capping gratis tags at 10% would yield a nice increase in draw odds. Which in turn might keep more youth and novice hunters in the field. Which is what we all should want if we want to keep hunting in the future.

How many tags will this yield per unit approximately to save the future? How about habitat, would thisnmot increase number of deer which in turn increases the number if tags? Which would stand a better chance for future hunters, shuffling numbers or improving an environment?

 

[WhiskeyRebellion]

I'm guessing referring to landowner gratis. Please elaborate on how it is such a major problem

Simple, I think we are killing sport by making harder to recruit and more importantly keep hunters. Who cares if you take a kid hunting for his youth season tag if he doesn't draw another tag for 5 years. He looses interest, and quits hunting. About half the buck tags in this state are removed as gratis tags before the drawing. Its hard enough to draw a tag without stacking the odds. Tons of people have quit hunting because they cant draw a tag. And you have to be honest... Opening day is not what it use to be. What happens when enough people loose interest? You do realize that hunters don't exactly have a majority anymore. Right now least most people are sympathetic to hunters because people they know hunt. What happens to deer hunting when that changes? Why make it harder on people?

I will hunt regardless if I draw a tag or not, most people will not. That is a problem....... Its only a matter of time before we loose our hunting rights to legislation if we don't keep people enough people interested.

 

[LBrandt]

What would happen if we just closed the season for lets say 2 or 3 years?

 

[Enslow]

Leave things be. The end

 

[WormWiggler]

Why I quit hunting
1. lack of access
2. lack of time
3. lack of energy / health
4. lack of money

None of these are the fault of G&F or landowners... if I owned land, I would post it and hunt it.