Several dead in Mandan

[dean nelson]

I would be very interested in know what some of you did before acquiring your highly coveted internet detective licenses. Can we just let the police do their jobs?

Yes because to wonder out loud is never done. On what planet do you live that you think people are not going to speculate on what the hell went down here seriously! 4 bodies found murdered that's all they've bothered to say and as such that will automatically trigger speculation because they're not saying anything to fill in the gigantic holes in the story!

 

[Obi-Wan]

along those same lines but a little more well known... sam berkowitz aka "the 44 cal killer" was discharged from the air force and my father was his captain and the guy giving him the boot, he told my father he was going to kill him and his whole family. well my father told him to give it a try, it was not too terribly long after that he was found in a basement on base suicide, in minot.

? David Berkowitz is in prison but is this the connection you are talking about?
http://criminalgenealogy.blogspot.com/2016/10/son-of-sam-connections-in-north-dakota.html


Son of Sam Connections in North Dakota Part II

John Carr was born abt 1947 most like in Yonkers NY. He died 16 Feb 1978 Minot Air Force Base Minot, ND to a gunshot to the head (Assumed Murdered) The police officials on the base ruled it a suicide. Yet he was found laying on his stomach, which would not happen because of the force of the blast to the head. Their Father Samuel was born on 14 Sep 1912 and died on 21 Mar 1996 he was 83 yrs old

I have yet to find any information on Samuel's wife.

Wheat Carr worked for the New York police Dept and married a police office. She was born about 1951 also most likely in Yonkers, NY.
This is all the information I could find on this family.

Michael Vail Carr & sister Wheat Carr

Maury Terry Author of The Ultimate Evil was able to connect the 1978 death of John Carr at Minot Air Force Base in North Dakota to both the Process Church and Son of Sam murders. Carr, who was shot in the head at the home of his girlfriend, was initially listed as a suicide, but it turned out, John’s father, Sam Carr of Yonkers, was the inspiration for the term “Son of Sam.” Berkowitz told Terry the group likely killed John Carr, a user of illicit drugs and diagnosed schizophrenic, because of his bizarre behavior and the fact he was untrustworthy. Berkowitz also fingered Carr as one of the Son of Sam shooters.




Michael was killed in a car crash in New York on 04 Oct 1979 He was born 12 Jun 1952 in Yonkers New York. The police report says there were no skid marks and looked suspicious.






Following his trip to Minot,ND. Terry next traveled to Stanford where he retraced Arlis Perry’s steps that led to her death. He concluded that as many as four people were involved in her murder, including Mentzer, and one or more cult members from Bismarck. Terry was of the opinion that Arlis did something back in Bismarck that convinced the group she had to die. “She might have heard or seen something she shouldn’t have,” he surmised. “They may have feared she would expose them.” Either that or she discovered there was a person, or persons, involved in Satanism, who, if exposed, would be greatly embarrassed and possibly lose a position of authority. “Someone in Bismarck okay-ed this and someone had the hooks to get help on the West Coast. This was a pretty sophisticated operation,” he insisted. “I think one of them was the law firm visitor. And one of those two still lives in Bismarck, ND.”




Rumors were circulating in Bismarck about well-known men and women who were members of a Satanic club that sacrificed animals and drank blood. Brad King, a Bismarck dentist and former classmate of Arlis Perry’s, recalled: “There were a lot of religious groups coming through town at the time. I remember seeing people dressed in priest’s outfits. But instead of white collars, they wore red collars and sported upside-down crosses draped around their necks. I think they were called the Holy Order of MANS.” Nevertheless, he wasn’t convinced Terry’s theories concerning Arlis’s death were correct. King recalled being interviewed in his office by California detectives just before he attended his 10-year class reunion. “The police heard a rumor that someone in our class had set up an altar for her, but it was just a couple of photos of her along with other classmates who passed away,” he said. Around the time of his 30th class reunion, King called law enforcement officers in Santa Clara County to ask if there had been any breaks in the case, but was told there was no new information. Of Terry’s book, King said: “It didn’t surprise me that someone came out with some kind of conspiracy around her murder. I don’t know if I agree with the author that she was stalked from Bismarck to California. I remember a lot of weird religious stories going on around here in that time, like convents dancing under the full moon and rituals taking place down by the river bottoms. But in her case, I think she was at the wrong place at the wrong time.”







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Michael Vail Carr and a sketch of one of the shooters

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[TD="class: tr-caption, align: center"]Sketches from witnesses of shooters
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[FONT="courier new" ][I]I am appalled at our police officials across this land. It would be so much better if they would just work together and share information. IT's everybody's sandbox!!!![/I][/FONT]




Update another North Dakota connection to Son of Sam
'Organic farmers' jailed for making drug 'crank' Leading North Dakota "organic farmers" Barry and Serena Dossenko were sentenced May 31 on charges of manufacturing illegal drugs and tax evasion by federal district judge Patrick Conmy. Barry Dossenko was sentenced to four years on charges of manufacturing methamphetamine, known as "crank" or "speed" and his wife Serena to one year on charges of tax evasion. The Dossenkos have been identified to EJR as associates of the satanic Son of Sam cultist
John Carr in Minot in the I 960s. Satanic paraphernalia was discovered on their property during the drug raids on their farm according to police. The prosecuting U. S. Attorney referred to Dossenko as a pioneer in the organic farming movement. They are activists who publish a newsletter and head an organic farming group called "Organic Futures," which sponsors meetings and seminars. They are active in the 'sustainable agriculture' circuit. A character witness for Dossenko was Dan Carlson, a University of Minnesota based geneticist who has invented a "miracle" fertilizer called "sonic bloom."
Source: Click here for Full Issue of EIR Volume 17, Number 24, June 8, 1990


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Posted by [URL="https://www.blogger.com/profile/17524308328701241801"]Gwen Kubberness[/URL] at 3:36 PM Email ThisBlogThis!Share to TwitterShare to FacebookShare to Pinterest​

 

[dean nelson]

One of the victims of the night stalker AKA Richard Ramirez used to be a regular at Sidelines may still possibly be I'm not sure.

 

[Obi-Wan]

I would be very interested in know what some of you did before acquiring your highly coveted internet detective licenses. Can we just let the police do their jobs?

I stayed at a holiday inn express last night

 

[Allen]

I read that book many years ago. Then a few years later when I lived in Williston, I found several spots not far from the Pumphouse that had all kinds of satanic crap painted on trees, and evidence of people gathering for more than just a few beers and some harmless fun.

Always kept me on my toes when I bow hunted the area.

 

[Bed Wetter]

I read that book many years ago. Then a few years later when I lived in Williston, I found several spots not far from the Pumphouse that had all kinds of satanic crap painted on trees, and evidence of people gathering for more than just a few beers and some harmless fun.

Always kept me on my toes when I bow hunted the area.

How was the hunting?

 

[fj40]

I'm heartened, slightly, by a few here who have cooler heads.

I think that the PD would be making a mistake, if their press conference indicated, in all caps (as some here would have it) that there IS A KILLER ON THE LOOSE.

I also think that the PD, even though not every single one of them are mental giants (like any other group of people) have at least some people who are much better at this business, than most of the NDA folk - no offense. I refer to myself too, naturally.

Further, to insinuate that the PD department is staffed by idiots, incompetent, or otherwise not performing up to your standards, because they're not playing their entire hand to the public, shows what little we know.

I do guess that it will be difficult for the killer(s) to hide. It is said that most crimes involve money or passion. Shouldn't be terrible hard to find people with motives.

Interesting reading this. I too, am a bit concerned about not naming a suspect, but on the other hand, after years in law enforcement, 20 of which I was the boss, i can only speculate they have a reason. As you state, there are some marginal to poor officers but most of them do not make it to detective or chief. In any investigation, unless absolutely positive, any release of info before 100% sure of it will come back to bite you during prosecution. I am willing at this point to give the benefit of doubt to the investigators and will only form an opinion at the completion of the case. I know, I am probably biased, but without knowing all the facts, I gotta go with the cops.

 

[guywhofishes]

One of the victims of the night stalker AKA Richard Ramirez used to be a regular at Sidelines may still possibly be I'm not sure.

 

[Davey Crockett]

I read that book many years ago. Then a few years later when I lived in Williston, I found several spots not far from the Pumphouse that had all kinds of satanic crap painted on trees, and evidence of people gathering for more than just a few beers and some harmless fun.

Always kept me on my toes when I bow hunted the area.

There was some crazy stuff in that book if it's the same one I read , Wasn't there mention of activity and meetings at UM in Bismarck along the river too ?

 

[dean nelson]

Nah more like this.
https://www.ocregister.com/2012/09/...-head-he-still-cant-escape-the-night-stalker/

 

[Obi-Wan]

There was some crazy stuff in that book if it's the same one I read , Wasn't there mention of activity and meetings at UM in Bismarck along the river too ?

According to the book there was. My wifes cousins lived S of Umary when they were kids and they talk about finding things related to satanic activity below the bluffs

 

[RustyTackleBox]

Yes obi it would be carr sorry i remembered the story incorrectly

 

[Trip McNeely]

I was being facetious.

i know... i was just stair-stepping off your already built in sarcasm

 

[guywhofishes]

imagine being Asian or other cultures and trying to understand our sarcasm

 

[Lou63]

imagine being Asian or other cultures and trying to understand our sarcasm

My wife is Asian and it can be a struggle ;:;rofl

 

[roosterfish]

Was a lot of connection to "son of sam" in Minot. Brother told me of a place just north of the old north kmart that had parties all the time and had weird paintings on the floor.of satanic stuff. We used to see people dressed in black capes by the old railroad yard having bon fires. scared the bajesus out of us when we were riding bike around at night.

 

[Rut2much]

I would be very interested in know what some of you did before acquiring your highly coveted internet detective licenses. Can we just let the police do their jobs?

its the internet man...sometimes the scooby doo squad is the team for the job! Everyone's being respectful and I don't see the harm in hearing other's opinions because this place oozes with smarts and common sense.. Just sayin'

 

[Bfishn]

Pretty close to 20 years ago, a pal and I were playing pool at Bucks, with our then girlfriends. A guy came up to buy them a drink, and I knew him slightly. When he realized that the gals were with us, he politely moved off. No big deal.

Couple hours later he shot and killed a coworker at the liquor store at which he worked, then robbed the place and took off for MT. He is now a guest of the penitentiary, in MT I believe.

The headlines (and photo) in the paper a day later, about stopped my heart.

I remember that liquor store being the main underage supply of booze in Bismarck for a few years until that happened. I believe I was a sophomore in HS at the time, I had plenty of friends who would walk in there and buy booze as 15-16 year olds. I remember it being quite the hit to the underage supply when that murder happened and the store shut down.

 

[AaronJ]

Was a lot of connection to "son of sam" in Minot. Brother told me of a place just north of the old north kmart that had parties all the time and had weird paintings on the floor.of satanic stuff. We used to see people dressed in black capes by the old railroad yard having bon fires. scared the bajesus out of us when we were riding bike around at night.

NW corner of town (now developed) had an old farmstead with a barn. Inside the barn I found blood, Satanic symbols, and animal carcasses. It would have been early 80s. It would be just west of the new (3 or so year old) grocery store and businesses and just east of the bypass.

 

[dblkluk]

NW corner of town (now developed) had an old farmstead with a barn. Inside the barn I found blood, Satanic symbols, and animal carcasses. It would have been early 80s. It would be just west of the new (3 or so year old) grocery store and businesses and just east of the bypass.

Ah yes, "the cult barn" as it was known by the kids in my neighborhood. There's a big newer house sitting on that exact spot now and I often wonder if the homeowners know what had supposedly went down in that piece of property.